27 replies to this topic

[REVICKHILLIS]

So two years ago in the draft, no one thought we would draft Brandon Graham. Obviously so far, he has not paned out. The jury is definitely still out on him. In this year's draft, do you think Andy surprises us with another "Brandon Graham" type pick? Who could that be? He loves to try and outsmart the other teams by taking players no one really isn't talking about in the first round.

[Nik Sneak]

Brandon Graham was easily the best player at the Senior Bowl. Brandon Graham prior to that senior bowl was already being talked about as a first round pick. Post senior bowl, it was evident the dude was going in the top half of the draft.

You can bash the pick all you want, but the value was not bad. Now choosing to take him before Earl Thomas, go ahead and rip that to shreds. However, I will say one more time - Brandon Graham was good value for where we selected him.

[Sebo]

REVICKHILLIS, on 09 February 2012 - 01:38 PM, said:

So two years ago in the draft, no one thought we would draft Brandon Graham. Obviously so far, he has not paned out. The jury is definitely still out on him. In this year's draft, do you think Andy surprises us with another "Brandon Graham" type pick? Who could that be? He loves to try and outsmart the other teams by taking players no one really isn't talking about in the first round.

Graham was regarded as a 1st round pick by all the draft services and so called experts that year?  Whats the surprise?

[REVICKHILLIS]

Sebo, on 09 February 2012 - 01:52 PM, said:

Graham was regarded as a 1st round pick by all the draft services and so called experts that year?  Whats the surprise?

He's another undersized player. If you watched the draft that year, Mel Kiper and Todd McShay both thought Earl Thomas was the pick. The next two players taken in the draft are by far superior players. JPP and Earl Thomas.

[Faunce]

Not a real surprise - was higher on NY draft board then JPP was (had a freak injury). PERIOD.  Earl Thomas was the most "obvious" choice to us fans - but time will tell who is the player with more longevity.  I am always more of a Marathon - not a sprint type of guy.  Good character guys will always be first choice in this organization if it's an "apples to apples" comparison skills wise - which I am more than okay with.

[Rodney_Zero]

REVICKHILLIS, on 09 February 2012 - 01:57 PM, said:

He's another undersized player. If you watched the draft that year, Mel Kiper and Todd McShay both thought Earl Thomas was the pick. The next two players taken in the draft are by far superior players. JPP and Earl Thomas.

Another as in who?, Parker, yes, but does he play well?, undersized?, go around and look at 4/3 rosters and look at the size of their DT's and DE's. Undersized?, does this mean you would've signed Ray Edwards last year in FA over Babin?, god I hope not, or we shouldv'e drafted Derrick Morgan over Graham?, Morgan tore his ACL too, but he's big, not undersized though, BTW, Graham had 3 sacks and led all rookie DE's in hurries, add in the fact that Mcderazz played him at DT not DE a lot.

[NWMontana]

Dline will be our first pick,  Mercilus, Still, Worthy....

[SBorBust]

Is a small, sophomore college strong safety (with questions about his run support) ever an "obvious pick" at 13?

[italianmafia23]

Brandon Graham was a fantastic selection at the time. Good fit. 5 star level recruit out of high school. Top flight, hall of fame level production in college. Lived in the backfield with more tackles for loss than the other top 3 DE's in the draft combined. MVP of the Senior Bowl. Referred to as "unblockable" in practice by Mike Mayock. NO INJURY HISTORY!

He came into training camp and what happened? He blew people away. Even getting the better of Peters at times. Looked like the best solid pass rusher on the team. Appeared as productive as Cole in 1on1 drills.

Then came preseason. Played a bit against starters. Excelled. Didn't rack up the sacks, but got pressure consistently and played the run surprisingly well. Hugh Douglas said his play was giving him "goosebumps" with how quickly he got into the backfield virtually every play.

Start of the season he hurt his foot. Did not look like the same player. The difference was night and day. Anyone that watched him in preseason could see his explosion off the line wasn't there. So he got limited playing time as a result. And yet, by the week of his injury he had BETTER stats than JPP.

Tears ACL and has microfracture surgery (not a guaranteed recovery) on top of that. Plays virtually no snaps at all this season as a direct result before being held out the rest of the season to exercise "caution" with his recovery. He could very well be done, but that's not due to bad scouting.

Everyone who criticizes BG tends to have one thing in common: Ignorance.

It was a bad pick in hindsight, no doubt, but nobody could have predicted that. JPP had boom or bust potential but minimal production in college. 6 sacks his senior season vs. Graham's 10 and a half.

People need to shut up and quit whining about the pick. The Eagles have made some baffling picks over the years. To anyone who knows what they are talking about, this wasn't one of them at the time.

[italianmafia23]

Faunce, on 09 February 2012 - 04:11 PM, said:

Not a real surprise - was higher on NY draft board then JPP was (had a freak injury). PERIOD.  Earl Thomas was the most "obvious" choice to us fans - but time will tell who is the player with more longevity.  I am always more of a Marathon - not a sprint type of guy.  Good character guys will always be first choice in this organization if it's an "apples to apples" comparison skills wise - which I am more than okay with.

In this league, DE will always be a more important position than Safety. Especially with the blueprint left by the past few Superbowl teams. Rushing the QB is key on defense.

[cmart102]

italianmafia23, on 11 February 2012 - 07:10 PM, said:

Everyone who criticizes BG tends to have one thing in common: Ignorance.

More like anyone who criticizes the pick, not the player. I'll blast Graham all I like for what he's done after being drafted, but I had no problem with selecting him

[italianmafia23]

cmart102, on 12 February 2012 - 06:13 PM, said:

More like anyone who criticizes the pick, not the player. I'll blast Graham all I like for what he's done after being drafted, but I had no problem with selecting him

Agreed.

Not that he had much control over his injury either, but the result certainly doesn't match the potential.

[cmart102]

italianmafia23, on 13 February 2012 - 01:06 AM, said:

Agreed.

Not that he had much control over his injury either, but the result certainly doesn't match the potential.

I mean more the coming in overweight

[italianmafia23]

cmart102, on 13 February 2012 - 10:26 AM, said:

I mean more the coming in overweight

I can definitely agree with that. However, I think it has been largely overblown. Jason Peters comes in overweight every year. I would imagine with a leg injury like BG had, he wasn't able to exert himself much in physical exercise. When he went to Michigan he started off close to 300 pounds. It seems to me his weight tends to go in that direction unless he works to keep it down. But he certainly doesn't seem to have any clue what would constitute a healthy diet, eating crunch berries for breakfast in the morning. I laughed at that while watching his training video for the combine, but when recovering from an injury like the one he had, good nutrition is very important for quick and effective recovery. It's something that is SEVERELY overlooked in sports and conditioning coaches I have listened to tend to relay information that is very outdated.

[E-A-G-L-E-S Eagles]

Seriously, Graham was a great pick that year.  At Michigan, he was a beast.  He backed that up in the Senior Bowl.  Sure, he had some issues - size, short arms - but his motor made up for that.  These injuries have just derailed his development by keeping him off the field.

Comparing him to JPP isn't really fair given JPP's health and opportunity, but he was a complete unknown that year, where Graham was proven.

[superbowlsoon]

I have to agree with the thought of Brandon Graham being a good pick, even in hindsight (with the tough start to his career). I watched a ton of Michigan games and he always stood out as a player. Even with the limited snaps on the Eagles, I can see lots of skill and signs of what he should develop into. He's strong for his height, quick, takes good angles, excellent in pursuit and has high character.

I see no reason outside injury that should keep him from turning into a 11 sack a year player who also amasses decent tackle #'s from the DE position. I truly believe he'll get there and I'm crossing my fingers he can stay off the trainers table. Would I have picked Earl Thomas at that spot?.....darn right I would have. When the Eagles passed on Thomas I was floored...., but that doesn't take away from me thinking Graham will be an impact DE.

Looking back, I would have taken Graham over JPP at the time as well. I think Piere Paul's great play is a surprise to most. He was the epitomy of "boom or bust." Graham was a much safer player to take at that position in the 1st round. I can't fault the team for making that decision even after the fact.

[PHeagles36]

REVICKHILLIS, on 09 February 2012 - 01:57 PM, said:

He's another undersized player. If you watched the draft that year, Mel Kiper and Todd McShay both thought Earl Thomas was the pick. The next two players taken in the draft are by far superior players. JPP and Earl Thomas.

We needed both a DE and a S about evenly. We liked the 2nd round S's more than the 2nd round DEs, and that's the story to that.

[HazletonEagle]

REVICKHILLIS, on 09 February 2012 - 01:38 PM, said:

So two years ago in the draft, no one thought we would draft Brandon Graham. Obviously so far, he has not paned out. The jury is definitely still out on him. In this year's draft, do you think Andy surprises us with another "Brandon Graham" type pick? Who could that be? He loves to try and outsmart the other teams by taking players no one really isn't talking about in the first round.

what are you talking about? tons of people here expected the Graham pick. And tons wanted him.

[joruz]

I haven't given up on Graham.  This year is his year to shine.

[eaglepride]

Take Devon Still if he's there at 15. Patterson had brain surgery so he may be iffy

[LaxPlayerX3]

Now that we have Washburn our drafting style will most like change and we can shoot for more high potential, raw players on the DL. Before we had to get NFL ready prospects because Seagrest wasn't about to coach anyone up.

[dublosausage]

italianmafia23, on 11 February 2012 - 07:10 PM, said:

Brandon Graham was a fantastic selection at the time. Good fit. 5 star level recruit out of high school. Top flight, hall of fame level production in college. Lived in the backfield with more tackles for loss than the other top 3 DE's in the draft combined. MVP of the Senior Bowl. Referred to as "unblockable" in practice by Mike Mayock. NO INJURY HISTORY! He came into training camp and what happened? He blew people away. Even getting the better of Peters at times. Looked like the best solid pass rusher on the team. Appeared as productive as Cole in 1on1 drills. Then came preseason. Played a bit against starters. Excelled. Didn't rack up the sacks, but got pressure consistently and played the run surprisingly well. Hugh Douglas said his play was giving him "goosebumps" with how quickly he got into the backfield virtually every play. Start of the season he hurt his foot. Did not look like the same player. The difference was night and day. Anyone that watched him in preseason could see his explosion off the line wasn't there. So he got limited playing time as a result. And yet, by the week of his injury he had BETTER stats than JPP. Tears ACL and has microfracture surgery (not a guaranteed recovery) on top of that. Plays virtually no snaps at all this season as a direct result before being held out the rest of the season to exercise "caution" with his recovery. He could very well be done, but that's not due to bad scouting. Everyone who criticizes BG tends to have one thing in common: Ignorance. It was a bad pick in hindsight, no doubt, but nobody could have predicted that. JPP had boom or bust potential but minimal production in college. 6 sacks his senior season vs. Graham's 10 and a half. People need to shut up and quit whining about the pick. The Eagles have made some baffling picks over the years. To anyone who knows what they are talking about, this wasn't one of them at the time.

The better part is that when this season rolls around, he will have an actual offseason to get used to the wide-9 when he's at 97+ % health.  Him on the edge (he has all the moves, has power, and has the speed - when he's healthy) and a tackle by himself on an island, it's going to be a lot of fun to watch.  I think he will be a close to 10 sack year (obviously with his knee holding up).  It's also going to be fun to watch him take a snap here and there from the middle of the line.

If it weren't for the injury, I think he would have been very productive.  I think the same thing for Allen (I fully expect him to really step up this year and wow the fans).  Both were good value (from a scouting view) where we selected them.  I think they both will be cornerstones.  I was higher on JPP but BG was not exactly a bad pick either IMO.  I think if you look at today, rather than when they were drafted,  BG is a better fit for the Washburn scheme than if we had JPP.

[igglesfan1968]

Sebo, on 09 February 2012 - 01:52 PM, said:

Graham was regarded as a 1st round pick by all the draft services and so called experts that year?  Whats the surprise?

Because most EXPERTS said he was better suited for a 3-4 as an OLB.  We already have one undersized DE in Cole.  So why draft another?  He's a BUST!

[Rodney_Zero]

igglesfan1968, on 23 February 2012 - 07:55 PM, said:

Because most EXPERTS said he was better suited for a 3-4 as an OLB.  We already have one undersized DE in Cole.  So why draft another?  He's a BUST!

Trent is 6' 3" 270,

That is on apr with 4/3 DE's

Dwight Freeney 6' 1" 260

Want more examples

[Rodney_Zero]

igglesfan1968, on 23 February 2012 - 07:55 PM, said:

Because most EXPERTS said he was better suited for a 3-4 as an OLB.  We already have one undersized DE in Cole.  So why draft another?  He's a BUST!

Because he went to Mich, played DE, is 6' 2" 268, kinda like lamar Woodly huh

[eaglepride]

Nik Sneak, on 09 February 2012 - 01:52 PM, said:

Brandon Graham was easily the best player at the Senior Bowl. Brandon Graham prior to that senior bowl was already being talked about as a first round pick. Post senior bowl, it was evident the dude was going in the top half of the draft.

You can bash the pick all you want, but the value was not bad. Now choosing to take him before Earl Thomas, go ahead and rip that to shreds. However, I will say one more time - Brandon Graham was good value for where we selected him.

Exactly what has he done for us. Don't tell me about injuries its part of the game and undersized DE/LB get hurt

[Utebird]

REVICKHILLIS, on 09 February 2012 - 01:38 PM, said:

So two years ago in the draft, no one thought we would draft Brandon Graham. Obviously so far, he has not paned out. The jury is definitely still out on him. In this year's draft, do you think Andy surprises us with another "Brandon Graham" type pick? Who could that be? He loves to try and outsmart the other teams by taking players no one really isn't talking about in the first round.

just because you thought the eagles wouldnt draft graham doesnt equal no one thought the eagles would draft him, i thought there was a fair chance they would, i thought it would come down between earl thomas, JPP or graham and out of those 3 i liked graham the most, thought earl thomas was too small which he has shown to be and JPP was to raw and had injury concerns with his back. in retrospect jpp would have been a better pcik but then again graham had a better rookie year then jpp before he got hurt.

[Rodney_Zero]

eaglepride, on 27 February 2012 - 10:18 PM, said:

Exactly what has he done for us. Don't tell me about injuries its part of the game and undersized DE/LB get hurt

What did Kyle Vandon Bosch do for Tenn & Detroit? (he missed two years with ACL tears)

What did Derrick Burgess do with Oakland? (He missed two years with foot injuries)