BillySims

Why do people consider Terrell Owens so "talented?"

685 posts in this topic

I've always thought people had the wrong perception of him, and one of the biggest ones is this idea that he somehow squandered something. Well, maybe his money, but he certainly didn't squander anything when it came to his football career.

On the contrary, I think Owens may be the biggest overachiever in the history of professional sports.

I don't know if anyone has ever actually watched him in practices, but if you did, you'd see that nothing he does comes naturally to him. He audibly grunts and groans every time he runs or makes a cut. He runs very sloppy routes. He struggles catching the football (we all know how many balls he drops). He has below average speed for a wide receiver. He's not really a great leaper, either.

When you add all of this up, you can see why he had to go to a division 1-AA school. You can see why he was the 12th receiver taken in the draft, 89th overall. He's just not all that naturally athletic.

Yet I hear people mention him in the same sentence as Randy Moss. He's really the furthest thing from Randy Moss. Moss was a national phenom, a big Deion Sanders. A one man show. If it hadn't been for his off field problems, he would have gone #1 overall in the draft.

He's more like Drew Pearson.

So what is it about him? It must be the physique. But do people honestly think that he just naturally has that great physique? That great physique of his was honed through years and years in the weight room. He wasn't born with 6 pack abs and an all-around chiseled frame. He worked for that. That's not talent, that's pure desire.

So many sided with Donovan McNabb during all the 2005 nonsense, but in that overblown "feud," one of those men was one of the most naturally gifted athletes at his position to ever play professional football. And that man was lazy and demonstrated a lack of dedication and underachieved. The exact opposite of the attributes possessed by the other man. And people sided with the former.

The power of media.

Yep.. It is never Owens' fault. Not in S.F, not in Philly, not in Dallas, not is some indoor football league.......

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you think that hard work is talent, then you simply don't know what "talent" means.

What you're saying is being able to walk is a talent. Because, with rare exception, everyone is able to work hard.

Sure, if Owens were in a wheelchair because of a genetic condition, or grew to be only 4'8," he'd never have played professional football, regardless of the work he put in.

But height isn't a freak'n talent. Nor is the ability to walk.

I love how people are taking me completely out of context, too, as if I said Owens has "no natural gifts." I'm talking in relative terms, here. What part of that don't you understand?

Todd Pinkston and James Thrash had natural gifts, too. They made it to the NFL, after all. But nobody is talking about how they were "great talents," or "squandered their incredible natural ability" or "could have been one of the greatest ever." Because they didn't. They pretty much did what they were expected to do at this level of football.

But Owens went as far above and beyond his level of talent as anyone who has ever played the game. Nobody expected him to be a great NFL receiver. Here's an abbreviated list of receivers in NFL history who had more natural ability than Terrell Owens, just so you can get what I'm talking about (though you probably still won't):

Randy Moss

Calvin Johnson

Andre Johnson

Torry Holt

Charles Rogers

Roy Williams

Steve Smith

Larry Fitzgerald

Tyrone Calico

Julio Jones

Miles Austin

Dez Bryant

Mike Quick

Braylon Edwards

David Terrell

Plaxico Burress

Koren Robinson

Santana Moss

Koren Robinson

Chris Chambers

Quincy Morgan

James Lofton

Bob Hayes

Stanley Morgan

Roy Green

Tim Brown

Andre Rison

Donte Stallworth

Javon Walker

Lee Evans

Reggie Williams

Marvin Harrison

Jerry Rice

Some of these guys lived up to their talent, some of them didn't. None of them exceeded their level of talent the way Owens did.

I almost threw up my dinner laughing at this retarded post.

I nominate this post for dumbest post of the YEAR.

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

:roll:

He said Jordan to McNabb, Rodman to Owens. Not Owens to Jordan.

No, he said:

Didnt Micheal Jordan get cut before!! Damn that no talent working so hard to be Great Man

That's what I was responding to. That's why I quoted it. You see that little quote box there in my post? That's what he wrote.

It's terrifying to think that some of the people in this thread graduated high school. Unreal what poor reading comprehension and overall grasp of the English language you possess.

Yep.. It is never Owens' fault. Not in S.F, not in Philly, not in Dallas, not is some indoor football league.......

Complete non-sequitur. That has absolutely nothing to do with what this thread is discussing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Blocking is just want to. It has nothing to do with talent.

Blocking takes talent and desire. As does every other facet of playing professional sports.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Blocking takes talent and desire. As does every other facet of playing professional sports.

I notice you never mentioned technique.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

TO was a phenomenal talent and a very hard-working receiver. He was/is also a sufferer of mental illness. It's sad. Had he not gone off the deep-end, he would've won 2 superbowls with donovan. His paranoia and narcisism turned him into absolute locker-room poison, especially discouraging to qbs - not only mcnabb, but bledsoe, romo, and palmer. The birds got burned by him, but no one can say we weren't warned.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here's what the GM said:

“I hear that he’s one of the greatest of all time, but I don’t buy it – never did,” said one general manager. “He drops balls. He’s not a natural catcher. He’s not a great route runner, blah, blah, blah. He’s big and strong and good with the run after the catch, if he catches it. I can give you 100 negatives. It’s just not worth it."

Is this a recent quote, or one from when he was in the prime of his career? If it's recent, then you're talking about an aged TO, not a TO during the prime of his career.

You also mentioned the Clark quote about TO's work ethic. Isn't Jerry Rice's work ethic why he was able to be in the league at such a high level for so long? Does that mean that Jerry Rice isn't very talented too?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

football is a team sport and terrel owens was one of the most selfish prima donnas to ever play the game. watch any game he ever played in, he would've rather scored 4 touchdowns and lose then get shut out while his team won. as far as backing mcnabb over owens, it all started in the game against the browns game 6 2004, eagles had the ball, team is huddling back up after a play and owens is telling mcnabb to throw him the ball he was wide open, mcnabb tells him to stfu and it was pretty much down hill from there.

as far as him single handedly almost winning the super bowl? his grand total of zero touchdowns really didn't help much, he had zero yac, belichick had his dbs play off owens and baited mcnabb into throwing owens the ball because he couldn't run.he was worthless in the super bowl and the two playoff wins were done without owens.

what is your point again about owens? he's a cancer, has been one on every team he played on, no matter how good his numbers were, i bet every gm he played for, wished they'd never met him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I notice you never mentioned technique.

I was gonna edit to throw in mote but that's implied. Balance, strength, knowledge of angles, technique, speed, etc. The initial argument from them was a one liner with no backing so doesn't take much to win that one :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

football is a team sport and terrel owens was one of the most selfish prima donnas to ever play the game. watch any game he ever played in, he would've rather scored 4 touchdowns and lose then get shut out while his team won. as far as backing mcnabb over owens, it all started in the game against the browns game 6 2004, eagles had the ball, team is huddling back up after a play and owens is telling mcnabb to throw him the ball he was wide open, mcnabb tells him to stfu and it was pretty much down hill from there.

as far as him single handedly almost winning the super bowl? his grand total of zero touchdowns really didn't help much, he had zero yac, belichick had his dbs play off owens and baited mcnabb into throwing owens the ball because he couldn't run.he was worthless in the super bowl and the two playoff wins were done without owens.

what is your point again about owens? he's a cancer, has been one on every team he played on, no matter how good his numbers were, i bet every gm he played for, wished they'd never met him.

The bolded part is incorrect. TO had 2 long catch and runs, both of which were later followed up with INTs.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The bolded part is incorrect. TO had 2 long catch and runs, both of which were later followed up with INTs.

Yup, very incorrect...that game wouldn't have been close if not for TO. And I'm sorry, but it's hard to call the Eagles' playoff run anything special when the championship game was against the Jim f'ing Mora and Mike Vick led Falcons.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is this a recent quote, or one from when he was in the prime of his career? If it's recent, then you're talking about an aged TO, not a TO during the prime of his career.

You also mentioned the Clark quote about TO's work ethic. Isn't Jerry Rice's work ethic why he was able to be in the league at such a high level for so long? Does that mean that Jerry Rice isn't very talented too?

That quote was from 2009, when he was playing in Buffalo. But the GM says, "never did," implying he's always felt the same way about him as a player.

The Clark quote was about Owens as a player, not about his work ethic. Clark said when he faced Owens, his unit never feared Owens in terms of route running or catching the ball. They only worried about him after the catch. This was in response to Darrelle Revis calling him a "slouch," which Clark basically agreed with.

The point of all this is, Owens is an athletically limited guy. But he pushed the limits, and he doesn't get credit for that. Instead, he gets the opposite - criticism for somehow not living up to his "enormous talent" and assertions he "could have been the greatest of all-time but he squandered it," which is ridiculous.

Rice was a hard worker, but he was more all-around talented than Owens. A step faster, much quicker, much smoother, much better hands, much better agility, which allowed him to be a much better route runner. A better leaper, and just made a lot of things look easy. The only real knock on Rice was his lack of straight line speed, but even there, he was a little better than Owens.

Rice went to a small school himself, but he absolutely dominated, and he was gifted enough that he was taken 16th in the draft.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If I have no idea, please explain it to me.

Numbers = / = talent.

Talent is something you are born with that you naturally excel at.

The most talented receivers ever don't typically have to go to division I-AA schools. They don't typically run 4.68 in the 40-yard-dash, leap only 33 inches, do poorly in the cone drill and shuttle as well, and get a "C-" grade from the team that drafted them in hands. They're not typically bench players on their varsity high school football teams (Owens got little playing time in high school, look it up).

Just because you didn't go to a D1 school doesn't mean you didn't have talent. That is just stupid thinking. Jerry Rice, Terrell Owens, Andre Reed, Walter Payton...the list goes on of players who made it from nothing schools. Today, Joe Flacco, our own DRC, and Vincent Jackson are examples of players from "nothing" schools. And who the hell cares how one did in high school? Michael Jordan was CUT from his high school team. Seems like he did okay after he worked his a** off one summer.

Talent with no work ethic is virtually worthless. If you took att the WR's in the NFL and had them run a 40, 99% of them would be within .2 secs of each other. Why do some excel and others do not? Everyone in the NFL has talent. Some just work harder and make it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This might be the biggest FAIL thread I've seen in a while.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just because you didn't go to a D1 school doesn't mean you didn't have talent. That is just stupid thinking. Jerry Rice, Terrell Owens, Andre Reed, Walter Payton...the list goes on of players who made it from nothing schools. Today, Joe Flacco, our own DRC, and Vincent Jackson are examples of players from "nothing" schools. And who the hell cares how one did in high school? Michael Jordan was CUT from his high school team. Seems like he did okay after he worked his a** off one summer.

Talent with no work ethic is virtually worthless. If you took att the WR's in the NFL and had them run a 40, 99% of them would be within .2 secs of each other. Why do some excel and others do not? Everyone in the NFL has talent. Some just work harder and make it.

He was never cut he played JV his freshman year. It's a great line used by motivational speakers, but it isn't true.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yup, very incorrect...that game wouldn't have been close if not for TO. And I'm sorry, but it's hard to call the Eagles' playoff run anything special when the championship game was against the Jim f'ing Mora and Mike Vick led Falcons.

Well, it's special to a lot of us because it's the only one that ended in a conference championship after 3 years of failure. If it weren't for the fact that we reached the Super Bowl, my 2 favorite playoff runs would be the 01, and 08 playoffs. The 01 team won the last ever game at the old Soldier Field, and the 08 team won the last ever playoff game at the old Giants Stadium.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, it's special to a lot of us because it's the only one that ended in a conference championship after 3 years of failure. If it weren't for the fact that we reached the Super Bowl, my 2 favorite playoff runs would be the 01, and 08 playoffs. The 01 team won the last ever game at the old Soldier Field, and the 08 team won the last ever playoff game at the old Giants Stadium.

If I were a Bucs fan I'd make a very hurtful comment ^_^

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just because you didn't go to a D1 school doesn't mean you didn't have talent.

[/Quote]

I never said that at all. Straw man argument.

That is just stupid thinking. Jerry Rice, Terrell Owens, Andre Reed, Walter Payton...the list goes on of players who made it from nothing schools.

Owens and Reed are perfect examples of huge overachievers.

Rice was the 16h overall pick. Payton the 4th overall pick. They were more talented for their position than either Owens or Reed, but still not all-time premier talents at their position. Premier and all-time players, yes, but there were many NFL running backs and receivers more talented than Payton and Rice. Running backs more talented than Payton include Bo Jackson, Barry Sanders, Blair Thomas, Herschel Walker, Reggie Bush, O.J. Simpson, and Adrian Peterson.

Today, Joe Flacco,

Flacco transferred from Pitt.

our own DRC,

Taken 16th overall in the draft. Where does DRC rank on your list of all-time corners?

and Vincent Jackson

His raw size is what makes him a productive player. Talent-wise, he's not off-the-charts. Still went higher in the draft than Owens (61st).

Where does he rank on your all-time WR list?

are examples of players from "nothing" schools. And who the hell cares how one did in high school? Michael Jordan was CUT from his high school team.

That's a myth. Scroll up.

Every now and then, a future professional-relative talented athlete will slip through the cracks in high school and walk on at some college. It's rare, but it happens. But once they get there, if they are productive and have tons of talent, they will show it in workouts, and the scouts will drool. Level of competition isn't enough of a knock to scouts where they'll knock an all-time talent out of the first round because of it. Jerry Rice is proof of that.

Talent with no work ethic is virtually worthless. If you took att the WR's in the NFL and had them run a 40, 99% of them would be within .2 secs of each other. Why do some excel and others do not? Everyone in the NFL has talent. Some just work harder and make it.

And yet Owens would be outside that 99%. He'd be towards the very back of all of them, with the Wes Welkers, Anquan Boldins, and Mike Williamses. And .2 seconds is a huge difference. That would generally be about 2 yards of separation in a 40 yard race.

I agree on talent with no work ethic being meaningless, but talent with a lesser work ethic certainly is not. In the past, there were Pro Bowl and Hall of Fame players who smoked cigarettes in their off time.

Then there are guys like Owens, who skip dinner on the team flight because they're serving pizza and he refuses to eat anything that isn't part of his strict diet during the season.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

http://sports.yahoo....owensfall102209

“I hear that he’s one of the greatest of all time, but I don’t buy it – never did,” said one general manager. “He drops balls. He’s not a natural catcher. He’s not a great route runner, blah, blah, blah. He’s big and strong and good with the run after the catch, if he catches it. I can give you 100 negatives. It’s just not worth it."

so just because 1 general manager said it. it must be true right?

Are people even reading my posts? This is a pro-Terrell Owens thread. I'm saying he doesn't have much talent, but he has the heart of a lion, and that's what made him such a great receiver.

I admire guys who work their asses off to make themselves successful a lot more than guys who are just born with great natural ability and succeed mostly on that.

TO has talent whether you like it or not

No, you're making up a false definition to suit your argument.

"Talent" does not mean "having skill."

heres from the very top of google

tal·ent/ˈtalənt/

Noun:

  • Natural aptitude or skill.
  • A person or people possessing such aptitude or skill

a person or people with a natural ability for being good at a particular activity

this is from http://www.macmillan.../briti****alent

and TO's particular activity is football

dictionary .com's definition of talent

1.

a special natural ability or aptitude

and their definition for aptitude

1.

capability; ability; innate or acquired capacity for something

heres one from http://www.businessd...ion/talent.html

1. A natural ability to excel at a duty or action.

a natural ability to do something well

http://www.definitio...finition/talent

a special, often creative natural ability or aptitude

I hate the man but all these definitions seem to fit TO very well

so are you going to sit there and tell me that all these sites were edited with false definitions just to suite the argument that is clearly right?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To say he had below average speed is ridiculous, he just didn't accelerate fast. His top gear speed was a lot better than you are willing to give him credit for.

His lack of acceleration wasn't an issue for the most part due to the fact that there were, and still to this day are very few cornerbacks who can physically match Owens at the LOS. He has longer arms in comparison to most cornerbacks and safeties that played over the past two decades and he was bigger/stronger then the majority of them as well.

How is he not naturally strong? One of the things he was best at was stiff arming defenders, requiring A LOT of natural strength.

I love how you bring up the point that he was the 12th WR taken in his draft class(3rd round, as you mention). How many D2 WR's go in the first round or second round even for that matter?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It sounds like anyone drafted after Owens pick (in any draft) and did well didn't have a lot of talent, but anyone drafted before his pick (in any draft) had a lot of talent. That's pretty much the qualifications that you are going with (unless they were really fast). So Tom Brady isn't very talented, but Michael Vick is (so is David Carr and Ryan Leaf). James Harrison and Bart Scott didn't have much talent, but Quinton Caver did.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If I were a Bucs fan I'd make a very hurtful comment ^_^

Believe me, the thought crossed my mind. I just didn't want to put it into words. :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

so just because 1 general manager said it. it must be true right?

If one GM thinks it, you can be sure others do, too. One GM vs. fans and media? I'll take the GM's opinion.

Did you ever see what Dwight Smith (when he was with the Bucs) said about Owens?

Before the game, he said all of Owens' big plays came off blown coverages and missed tackles, and you never see him out-running anymore. And he mentioned that he's not even close to Moss.

After the Bucs defeated the 49ers in a 2002-03 divisional playoff game, Smith said the Bucs didn't need to double him, asking, "who's he going to go out-run? He couldn't even catch Ronde after the pick. We didn't need to double him."

A defensive back from the IFL said Owens was nowhere near as physical or fast as he was expecting him to be. This is an IFL player saying that.

Owens was voted "most overrated player" more than once in polls.

Revis called him a "slouch."

NFL defensive backs don't seem to have a whole lot of respect for Owens's talent, either. They only worry about his size and strength after the catch.

TO has talent whether you like it or not

Well, now there's a great argument.

heres from the very top of google

tal·ent/ˈtalənt/

Noun:

  • Natural aptitude or skill.
  • A person or people possessing such aptitude or skill

a person or people with a natural ability for being good at a particular activity

this is from http://www.macmillan.../briti****alent

and TO's particular activity is football

dictionary .com's definition of talent

1.

a special natural ability or aptitude

and their definition for aptitude

1.

capability; ability; innate or acquired capacity for something

heres one from http://www.businessd...ion/talent.html

1. A natural ability to excel at a duty or action.

a natural ability to do something well

http://www.definitio...finition/talent

a special, often creative natural ability or aptitude

Do you see the word, "natural," in all the definitions you provided?

I hate the man but all these definitions seem to fit TO very well

No, they really don't.

so are you going to sit there and tell me that all these sites were edited with false definitions just to suite the argument that is clearly right?

No, I'm going to say you don't know how to comprehend what you read.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You know that 38 years old is not exactly going to be your prime, right?

Ask the corners who played against a 28 year old TO what they thought about him. I can guarantee you no one said "slouch".

6th in receptions, ever.

4th in TDs, ever.

2nd in receiving yards, ever.

What, exactly, is wrong with you that you could honestly believe that's possible with a lack of talent?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now