31 replies to this topic

[TheRealTruth]

Louis Riddick - came to Philly in 2008
  -8 years prior with Redskins (2000-2008) lackluster drafting by that team.

Anthony Patch - 9th season with the Eagles

Brett Veach - Was an ASSISTANT for Andy Reid at training camp, 1st year as a scout
- In his defense he played 4 years of I-AA football at Delaware

Sean Gustus - 7th year with Eagles

Andy Speyer - 9th year with Eagles

The list goes on, our scouts are either unqualified or have been here through every single bad draft. These are the same scouts that figured:
-Freddie MItchell would be better than Reggie Wayne and Chad Johnson
-LJ Smith was better than Lance Briggs or Jason Witten
-Mike Patterson was a safer pick than Logan Mankins or Michael Roos
-Bunkley was more than just a 1 year wonder
-Danny Watkins was the most NFL ready guard of his draft class

The list goes and extends into deeper rounds.
I understand there are plenty of other factors (team need at the time, scheme, Andy Reid)...and no team has a perfect track record with drafting. But you have to admit, our scouting is average at best. We waste so many picks on guys that are projected to be studs in the NFL but fall way short when they get here. Not every pick should be a pro bowl impact player...but more of them should at least be able to stay on the team and contribute for a few years.

Can the scouting department rightfully take a piece of the blame?

[WtfaRabbit!]

The problem is that they can't scout defensive players.

[Morton]

Definitely something to think about.

However, I have to think that most of this goes back to the General Manager(s) in charge of the team over the years who have final say over scouts' input.

Whether it's the scouts, or the general manager, or the coach, someone here has been absolutely abysmal at identifying talent in the college draft and it has created a bottom-feeder team that will have to be rebuilt once again through multiple drafts in order to be a real contender.

[zenclaybourne]

TheRealTruth, on 01 November 2012 - 11:49 AM, said:

Louis Riddick - came to Philly in 2008
  -8 years prior with Redskins (2000-2008) lackluster drafting by that team.

Anthony Patch - 9th season with the Eagles

Brett Veach - Was an ASSISTANT for Andy Reid at training camp, 1st year as a scout
- In his defense he played 4 years of I-AA football at Delaware

Sean Gustus - 7th year with Eagles

Andy Speyer - 9th year with Eagles

The list goes on, our scouts are either unqualified or have been here through every single bad draft. These are the same scouts that figured:
-Freddie MItchell would be better than Reggie Wayne and Chad Johnson
-LJ Smith was better than Lance Briggs or Jason Witten

None of those guys were around long enough to be a part of the Freddie Mitchell selection, and I don't think they would have been here for LJ either. 2003 was ten drafts ago now.

[TheRealTruth]

zenclaybourne, on 01 November 2012 - 12:01 PM, said:

None of those guys were around long enough to be a part of the Freddie Mitchell selection, and I don't think they would have been here for LJ either. 2003 was ten drafts ago now.

You are right, my mistake. That doesn't change the underlying point that whoever was doing our talent eval in those days and these days is clearly sub-par at his job

[zenclaybourne]

TheRealTruth, on 01 November 2012 - 12:05 PM, said:

You are right, my mistake. That doesn't change the underlying point that whoever was doing our talent eval in those days and these days is clearly sub-par at his job

You make a good point about Watkins, though I think you're stretching a little with Bunkley and Patterson. Jarrett definitely belongs on this list along with Teonesheim(sp?). Guys that were so bad they were cut after a year or two.

[NOTW]

The entire organization is to blame.  It's just been too long and too many problems to keep track of.  Time for a change...everywhere.

[nottsfootballfan]

And who hired the scouts?

[The_Talon]

TheRealTruth, on 01 November 2012 - 11:49 AM, said:

you have to be the biggest troll in EMB history. I've seen some bad ones come along but you take the cake. Like I said earlier, just go root for someone else. You're just grasping at straws. You blame ownership, you blame coaching, you blame players, you blame scouting. Next thing you'll start a thread about the groundskeepers. Give it a rest.

[TravelerVic]

It takes two to dance. Is it the scouts or Bad GM? It could be both. It could also be faulty philosophy. Scouts do not go drafting the smallest shrimps out there. Andy does! The scouts do not develop the players once they get here. The coaches are supposed to do that...But Eagles coaches were / are Highly overrated. They do not develop player well. The bottom line where Andy is right ...it is a whole team effort. Right now the team is like a Titanic...Nice on paper but slowly sinking.

[biglou22]

TheRealTruth, on 01 November 2012 - 11:49 AM, said:

Louis Riddick - came to Philly in 2008
  -8 years prior with Redskins (2000-2008) lackluster drafting by that team.

Anthony Patch - 9th season with the Eagles

Brett Veach - Was an ASSISTANT for Andy Reid at training camp, 1st year as a scout
- In his defense he played 4 years of I-AA football at Delaware

Sean Gustus - 7th year with Eagles

Andy Speyer - 9th year with Eagles

The list goes on, our scouts are either unqualified or have been here through every single bad draft. These are the same scouts that figured:
-Freddie MItchell would be better than Reggie Wayne and Chad Johnson
-LJ Smith was better than Lance Briggs or Jason Witten
-Mike Patterson was a safer pick than Logan Mankins or Michael Roos
-Bunkley was more than just a 1 year wonder
-Danny Watkins was the most NFL ready guard of his draft class

The list goes and extends into deeper rounds.
I understand there are plenty of other factors (team need at the time, scheme, Andy Reid)...and no team has a perfect track record with drafting. But you have to admit, our scouting is average at best. We waste so many picks on guys that are projected to be studs in the NFL but fall way short when they get here. Not every pick should be a pro bowl impact player...but more of them should at least be able to stay on the team and contribute for a few years.

Can the scouting department rightfully take a piece of the blame?

My god in reading some of the other responses it is more then obvious you FANS have no clue about the draft success in the ENTIRE NFL by EVERY team. You guys talk like everybody has great drafts but the Eagles.
You people really don't know how other teams draft ??? Seriously ??

1st understand that the Eagles draft success is pretty typical of the better drafting teams in the NFL. The same misses and reaches the Eagles do is 100% identical to EVERY team in the NFL. Sad but true.

100% of every team in the NFL is a complete mess when it comes to drafting.
But like coaches these friggen scouts just get recycled. Whether they do a good job or not almost doesn't matter. Like coaches, they get fired from 1 team and hired by another team. Fired and hired. It's a never ending cycle.
You only see what the Eagles do. But go spend some time and look at EVERY teams draft. It's shocking the debacle EVERY team is when it comes to drafting.

The NFL takes "the good ole buy network" to a whole different level. I personally find is embarrassing and comical at the same time.

[SirReal]

EVERYbody gets a piece of the blame.

Even the peanut vendors who aren't doing their bit to pump up the crowd.

Everybody.

[biglou22]

SirReal, on 01 November 2012 - 12:58 PM, said:

EVERYbody gets a piece of the blame.

Even the peanut vendors who aren't doing their bit to pump up the crowd.

Everybody.

I can't believe you are picking on the PEANUT VENDORS.
That ain't right man.

[FanSinceWayBack]

Andrew Walter Reid is 129-85-1 as Eagles HC. He is 10-9 in the playoffs. 1 Conf. Championship | 7x Divisional Champs | 1 SB appearance. He has been a good coach for the most part and also endured tragedy. I do think its time for a change, but I wish him well. Once he gets out, takes a step back, and puts things into perspective Im sure he will see he should have let it go after McNabb went. Vicks success in 2010 is why we are were we are

[SirReal]

biglou22, on 01 November 2012 - 01:47 PM, said:

I can't believe you are picking on the PEANUT VENDORS.
That ain't right man.

Only people who haven't been hated on yet  

Well, them and the cheerleaders

[Rodney_Zero]

And here I thought our scouts where Matt Millen and Al Davis

[biglou22]

FanSinceWayBack, on 01 November 2012 - 03:14 PM, said:

Andrew Walter Reid is 129-85-1 as Eagles HC. He is 10-9 in the playoffs. 1 Conf. Championship | 7x Divisional Champs | 1 SB appearance. He has been a good coach for the most part and also endured tragedy. I do think its time for a change, but I wish him well. Once he gets out, takes a step back, and puts things into perspective Im sure he will see he should have let it go after McNabb went. Vicks success in 2010 is why we are were we are

Very well said.

[pgcd3]

Years ago Jim Mora called Mike Vick a coach killer. Andy Reid may well become his biggest catch. No one will begin next season with Vick as a starter

[FanSinceWayBack]

Quote

Years ago Jim Mora called Mike Vick a coach killer

His own coach when bad and opposing coach when good haha yes he is anyway you cut it

[biglou22]

pgcd3, on 01 November 2012 - 10:18 PM, said:

Years ago Jim Mora called Mike Vick a coach killer. Andy Reid may well become his biggest catch. No one will begin next season with Vick as a starter

LMFAO. I swear I was just going to put something that on here. And that was SR not JR that said that correct ??
But how true. Reid went to bed with him and it will likely get him fired.

[ronlandis]

Who are the superstars of professional football scouting and how do you get them to join the Eagles?

It's fine to say this scouting department has failed and I agree with you too, but that is a far cry from a solution.

I don't know how to fix this.

[iladelphxx]

Quote

“The front-office situation in Philadelphia is not a good one. Scouts are not allowed to talk to coaches during training camp. You’re talking about some scouts who have known the coaches for years. Coaches coach, scouts scout and that’s the way it is. It’s not a happy environment. It’s a divisive, paranoid place, and it’s hard to grow and jell as a team in that type of setting. That’s the result of hiring a very insecure GM who does not know football.”

http://www.the700lev...?blockID=791935

[FanSinceWayBack]

ronlandis, on 01 November 2012 - 10:51 PM, said:

Who are the superstars of professional football scouting and how do you get them to join the Eagles?

It's fine to say this scouting department has failed and I agree with you too, but that is a far cry from a solution.

The FO needs to do there homework and find someone good and established OR perhaps take a chance on someone who is unappreciated/underpaid. I honestly havent delved that far into the Eagles organization, but Im going to start scanning draft picks for all 32 teams. Maybe a college coach? Not necessarily a HC, but a coach. Like I said Idk, but Im going to look into it.

[Don Corleone]

I'm not saying the scouts aren't a problem, but at the same time, who are the brain trusts in the Eagles war room drafting these guys? Shouldn't they be better at evaulating talent?

[johncp]

WtfaRabbit!, on 01 November 2012 - 11:51 AM, said:

The problem is that they can't scout defensive players.

Have not done to good with off.lm ,big wr  either.
The wr we traded to the Rams. (gibson  I think ) would look good as
our big red zone rec. over what we have now. Whose Idea was that ?

[biglou22]

ronlandis, on 01 November 2012 - 10:51 PM, said:

Who are the superstars of professional football scouting and how do you get them to join the Eagles?

It's fine to say this scouting department has failed and I agree with you too, but that is a far cry from a solution.

I don't know how to fix this.

Obviously since every team in the NFL blows at drafting there are none.
Seriously. If you think drafting is any better on other teams then you aren't following the other teams close enough.
Go take a look at every teams picks over the last 5-6 years. You will swear your dog (if you have one) could do better.
It's a disgrace.
That's why every year I laugh my arse off during the draft when these EXPERTS talk up every kid picked. Meanwhile you 100% know for a fact that MOST will not come close to being the player that was expected. And the vast majority will be out of the league within a few years.
This sounds weird, but knowing that EVERY year about 3 of the top 10 will be busts, and 3 of the next 10 will be busts and 4 of the final 12 in the 1st rd will be busts. I try to guess which ones it will be.

Look. as long as these teams are going to keep reaching for players like a M.Sanchez, and get caught up in the college hype with players like B.Quinn and be infatuated with players like J.Russell, they will always suck at drafting.
It is mind boggling to me in watching those players in college that any scout would ever dream that they would turn out to be quality NFL players. I mean what the hell are they looking at.

[pgcd3]

Answering the earlier biglou post, it was Sr. And Reid seems intent on riding the ship down with Vick rather than playing Foles and perhaps saving his job

[Don Corleone]

There is no Jim Mora Jr.  The Falcons former coach doesn't have the same name as his dad. Jim E Mora (father) Jim L Mora (son)

[pgcd3]

Valid point on the Mora's. heard that before but for all intents and purposes they are distinguished in the football world by jr and sr

[Don Corleone]

pgcd3, on 02 November 2012 - 10:24 PM, said:

Valid point on the Mora's. heard that before but for all intents and purposes they are distinguished in the football world by jr and sr

Yeah, I thought they were Sr. and Jr. until I heard Mike&Mike talking about this, Golic said "funny thing is Jim Mora isn't a Jr." But, yes I agree in the football world they are Sr & Jr