EagleJoe8, on 12 December 2012 - 05:55 PM, said:
Lou, you know I think highly of you, but one thing I hate, is when you throw claims out there that I never made. No where did I say a new coach has to make the NFCCG or win the division every year. No where did I even imply it. I am well aware that a new coach may not work out. I am well aware that it could possibly take 2 or 3 coaches coming in before we find another good one. My point is, I'm tired of seeing the same things year after year with Reid, with nothing to show for it. Furthermore, you and I have differing views of what "very successful" is, especially as it relates to the 6 year period between 2005, and 2010. I'm also not willing to dismiss the last 2 seasons, (counting this current one). In those 8 years, he has 2 division titles, as opposed to 4 the previous 6. He has 3 playoff wins, as opposed to 7 the previous 6. He has 3, 10 win seasons, as opposed to 5 the previous 6. He's missed the playoffs or failed to win at least 1 playoff game 6 times, as opposed to 1 time the previous 6. Also, in his first 6 seasons, he won 64 regular season games. In the last 8, he's won 66, (with 3 more at best).
Sorry, but I just don't see his time here post Super Bowl as being anything close to "very successful".
It screams mediocre.
Here is why I take it the way I take it. You say that he was EXCELLENT up until 2004. Well you, along with MANY fans say that like that is a normal happening in the NFL. I'm not sure you understand how rare what Reid did from 2000 - 2004 is and was. Hell, even before free agency and the salary cap changed football that was hard to do. Now it's almost impossible to maintain winning at that level for 5 years. Go back and look. The ONLY coaches that have done that since the mid 90's (when FA and SC started) has been Belichick and Coughlin. And we are talking about well over 150 different coaches since then. No other coach has come close to doing what Reid did in a 5 year span. So to expect any coach to do better then that is simply unrealistic.
Then many fans complain that what he did from 2005 - 2010 was somehow bad. And all I ever do is point out that yes, while it's not as good as the 2000-2004 period, or as good as we all wanted,, COMPARED TO THE REST OF THE NFL it was still dam good. Yet fans think he sucked in those years.
I'm not going to go back and look it up again, but I believe in that 6 year period there were only 4 coaches in the NFL with more success then Reid in that 6 year period.
Again, was it as good as SOME fans THINK it should be, or was it as good as his previous 5 years ??? No. But whether it's being a CEO of a company or a head coach, all you can do is compare them to others success in the same field. And compared to the other 31 teams in the league and the carousel of head coaches in that same period, Reids years from 2005 - 2010 were still some of the most successful in the entire NFL.
Now, you want to talk about his failures in the last 2 years ??? Absolutely. These 2 years have been bad. Specifically this year.
And I absolutely think it is time for him to move on. But my god, to think any coach that has won like Reid has won from 2000 - 2010 is a bad coach is just silly. And when you look at those years, literally the only way a new coach coming in can do better for the Eagles is to win a SB. Not an easy task.
Last,,,, you have to remember that I understand that I am in a minority and don't judge a coach or player by what they do in a single season or a single win. There are so many coaches that have had that 1 LUCKY year and won a SB that I don't even look at winning a SB to determine how good they are. It's part of it. But only a small part. There are to many coaches that you take that single SB year out of their career and it completely changes what they have accomplished and what they really are. That list is getting longer almost every year.
Go take out J.Gruden's SB year from his career. Makes Reids years from 2005 -2010 look like Lombardi.
Take out S.Paytons SB year from his career record. Again, makes Reid 's years from 2005 - 2010 look like the next coming of Belichick.
Hell, go take away M.Shanahan's 2 SB years from his 19 years as head coach and you have what appears to be a terrible coach.
19 years of coaching.
6 lousy trips to the playoffs in those 19 years. SIX !!!!!!!!!!!
4 1st rd losses in those 6 years.
7 times - that's the amount of years in the 19 he was able to win 10 games. 7 stinking times.
8 times - that's the amount of years he was able to have a winning record. That's not even 1/2 the friggen time.
Yet fans think he was this great coach becuase of those 2 years. Obviously his career record says otherwise.
Now, do I expect the next coach to be as good as Reid was from 2000-2010 ??? Absolutely not. The chances of that happening are so small, it's almost not a thought. But do I want it to happen ??? You bet.
And in reading what most fans appear to be saying it seems like this is what they are certain will happen.................
1 - fire Reid
2 - hire a new coach
3 - give said coach his 1 or 2 years of rebuilding
4 - win a SB
And in reality, if Lurie doesn't get lucky, the next coach will simply be the 1st in a list of new Eagle coaches to join the famous endless NFL coaching carousel.
Don't get me wrong. I hope that Lurie hits it and we can all say, "dam, I wish Lurie would have canned Reid a lot sooner"
Sadly history says that we will be wishing Reid never left.