186 replies to this topic

[FanSinceWayBack]

Just like the title states...

[italianmafia23]

They keep losing, so he must be the problem! Lol.

[FanSinceWayBack]

italianmafia23, on 14 December 2012 - 02:16 AM, said:

They keep losing, so he must be the problem! Lol.

lol Im sure its ALOT deeper than that


Since AR has so much power, Im not sure who is a Howie pick and who is a AR pick?

Seems like about 80% of the boards hate Howie and Im just wanting to see some of peoples examples/explanations as to why

[italianmafia23]

Well, Howie does the contracts. That much we know. And he has done an amazing job there, at least. Who would have thought we could bring in virtually every big name free agent and remain under the cap? Of course, it didn't work, but it's what every fan wanted anyway. Who could have foreseen so many Pro Bowl players under performing so badly at the same time on a previous playoff caliber team resulting in the implosion we are currently witnessing?  At least -- somehow -- we signed all these huge names without shooting ourselves in the foot in the long term.

Howie also has a lot to do with trades. He got away with highway robbery on the Kolb and Ryans trades, but failed big time (on first glance) with the Asante trade (though, after his first 2 starts, Bryce appeared to have bailed him out).

With all that said, though, the disrespectful treatment to Mike Patterson appears to have been on Howie.

[FanSinceWayBack]

italianmafia23, on 14 December 2012 - 02:58 AM, said:

Well, Howie does the contracts. That much we know. And he has done an amazing job there, at least. Who would have thought we could bring in virtually every big name free agent and remain under the cap? Of course, it didn't work, but it's what every fan wanted anyway. Who could have foreseen so many Pro Bowl players under performing so badly at the same time on a previous playoff caliber team resulting in the implosion we are currently witnessing?  At least -- somehow -- we signed all these huge names without shooting ourselves in the foot in the long term.

Howie also has a lot to do with trades. He got away with highway robbery on the Kolb and Ryans trades, but failed big time (on first glance) with the Asante trade (though, after his first 2 starts, Bryce appeared to have bailed him out).

With all that said, though, the disrespectful treatment to Mike Patterson appears to have been on Howie.

I agree with that. I wanna stray from the pack and say I like Howie more than not, but I will admit I dont know much about FO situations.

He did get a steal on Ryans.
I would trade Kolb for DRC + 2nd all day long. DRC is disappointing me with his lack of effort, but I can see the value.

I liked the Nnamdi signing like everyone else.

I mean he IS the youngest GM in the league. He's been with the team in some aspect since 2000.  He's seen how things (contracts, drafts, etc etc)  were handled before him. He seems to me to be a intelligent guy, but Im not sure how that reverts over to football.

I think about 95% of this board is ready to have Reid fired. Look at AR now. He doesnt really have fire, or emotion, just like this team. He doesnt hold players accountable and since he's such a homer (Hires & Promotes friends) and arrogant his coaching staff for the MOST part is just as bad. Whos to say that some of those players that didnt pan out would have contributed in some way, if we had a coach. Dont get me wrong I appreciate AR and what hes done here, but Im just frustrated.

He talks about "Needing to do a better job" "Thats my responsibility, I gotta make sure my guys are ready to play" "We gotta do a better job at protecting the ball"  Put that on repeat and you have everyone of his pressers in a losing effort. At the end of the day if its not getting better on the field, wouldnt that make AR all talk? Kinda like his team?

Great coaches get the most out of there players. They know what there looking for and what there trying to accomplish.

BB of the Pats had WR's playing DB on a playoff team.
Like for real, I dont even think we game plan. We look the same week in and week out and that look is shhit!
AR isnt diverse enough. He doesnt know how or doesnt believe in scheming. I think tonights game was the 1st game all season we didnt open in a PA pass. Any avid Eagles fan can call what play is coming 60%-65% of the time based off of formation and down & distance. So what makes anyone think that an opposing D Coordinator cant pick up on this?

Why do the Giants always have a Beastly D-Line?
Why do the Ravens/Steelers always have stud LB's and secondary pieces?

Great GM + Coach combo??

Im not saying we have a great GM by any stretch of the imagination, but AR doesnt seem like he gets the most out of his players.
Of course all the players love him its like having a substitute teacher. All the kids in the class know they can do pretty much what ever they want and get away with it.

[FanSinceWayBack]

Ok so I went back and looked at the 99-Present drafts. Like I said above Idk which picks are GM picks and which picks are AR's. Im sure someone out there knows and hopefully they chime in and add to the discussion.

Im going to make it simple and just mark players I think are/had good value at that pick.

All of this is JUST MY OPINION

KEY -  GOOD | Bad will just be left as is

- 1999 Draft Class -

Donovan McNabb
Barry Gardner
Doug Brzezinski
John Welbourn
Damon Moore
Na Brown
Cecil Martin
Troy Smith
Jed Weaver
Pernell Davis

- 2000 Draft Class -

Corey Simon
Todd Pinkston
Bobbie Williams
Gari Scott
Thomas Hamner
John Frank
John Romero

- 2001 Draft Class -

Freddie Mitchell
Quinton Caver
Derrick Burgess
Correll Buckhalter
Tony Stewart
AJ Feeley

- 2002 Draft Class -

Lito Sheppard
Michael Lewis
Sheldon Brown
Brian Westbrook
Scott Peters
Freddie Milons
Tyreo Harrison
Raheem Brock

- 2003 Draft Class -

Jerome McDougle
LJ Smith
Billy McMullen
Jamaal Green
Jeremy Bridges
Norman LeJeune

- 2004 Draft Class -

Shawn Andrews
Matt Ware
JR Reed
Trey Darilek
Thomas Tapeh
Andy Hall
Dexter Wynn
Adrien Clarke
Bruce Perry
Dominic Furio

- 2005 Draft Class -

Mike Patterson
Reggie Brown
Matt McCoy
Ryan Moats
Sean Considine
Todd Herremans
Trent Cole
Scott Young
Calvin Armstrong
Keyonta Marshall
David Bergeron

- 2006 Draft Class -

Broderick Bunkley
Winston Justice
Chris Gocong
Max Jean-Gilles
Jason Avant
Jeremy Bloom
Omar Gaither
LaJuan Ramsey

- 2007 Draft Class -

Kevin Kolb
Victor Abiamiri
Stewart Bradley
Tony Hunt
CJ Gaddis
Brent Celek
Rashad Barksdale
Nate Ilaoa

- 2008 Draft Class -

Trevor Laws
DeSean Jackson
Bryan Smith
Mike McGlynn
Quintin Demps
Jack Ikegwuonu
Mike Gibson
Joe Mays
Andy Studebaker
King Dunlap

- 2009 Draft Class -

Jeremy Maclin
LeSean McCoy
Cornelius Ingram
Victor Harris
Fenuki Tupou
Brandon Gibson
Paul Fanaika
Moise Fokou

- 2010 Draft Class -

Brandon Graham
Nate Allen
Daniel Te'o-Nesheim
Trevard Lindley
Keenan Clayton
Mike Kafka
Clay Harbor
Ricky Sapp
Riley Cooper
Charles Scott
Jamar Chaney
Jeff Owens
Kurt Coleman

- 2011 Draft Class -

Danny Watkins
Jaiquawn Jarrett
Curtis Marsh
Casey Mattews
Alex Henery
Dion Lewis
Julian Vandervelde
Jason Kelce
Brian Rolle
Greg Lloyd
Stanley Havili

- 2012 Draft Class -

Fletcher Cox
Mychal Kendricks
Vinny Curry
Nick Foles
Brandon Boykin
Dennis Kelly
Marvin McNutt
Brandon Washington
Bryce Brown
__________________________________________________________________________________________________________

After looking at these draft picks from the last 12-13 years I dont see a huge decline in Draft Picks from 1 GM to the next.

[cb4130]

King Dunlap- LOL


Brandon Graham- Over JPP??? LOL

[FanSinceWayBack]

cb4130, on 14 December 2012 - 05:48 AM, said:

King Dunlap- LOL


Brandon Graham- Over JPP??? LOL

I said IMO ( That means IN MY OPINION)

Brandon Graham hasnt been playing well at all has he?

King Dunlap was a 7th round pick. He, like most of the OLine, is either terrible or struggling/not fit for overrated Mudd's scheme. I added players like Burnt Coleman and Queen Dunlap because they are 7th rounders. If you knew anything about football you'd know that if a guy from the 7th round makes your football team, then thats a 'value pick'.

Dont get in over your head there sunny boy

[TenaciousEagles]

Kennan Clayton, Curtis Marsh, Kurt Coleman, Dion Lewis, Nate Allen, Clay  Harbor   Really??????  Just because some of these guys get occasional playing time does not make them good players.  The personnel on this team is putrid, these guys would not play on ANY other team in the NFL.

[EagleJoe8]

LJ Smith was never more than average, and the pick is made to look worse when you consider we could have had Witten.

[DonCornelious]

It's easy to look back at a draft 12 years ago and say that someone was not good as opposed to looking at someone that is on the roster of a bad team and saying they are good.  So you say someone like Dion Lewis is good, but Ryan Moats was not?  They are the exact same player, in fact look at Moats' career stats, Lewis should be happy if his career numbers end up at the level of Moats. Similarly, look at the numbers between Riley Cooper and someone like Freddy Mitchell.  

Looking back at those drafts, 2002 was by far the best draft during the Reid era.  4 high quality starters (5 if you include Brock, 3 of them pro-bowl players).  I think we will be lucky to get 1 pro-bowl player out of the last 3 drafts.  I have no idea of how much influence Roseman had over the drafts and things like the Washburn signing, but I can say that the talent level on this team is awful.  

One of the big problems I have with Roseman is that I don't think he has an understanding of how a team should be built and knowledge of personnel to understand how players fit in.  I look at the FAs he pushed for and brought in.  These players include NNamdi, Jenkins, Babin, Young, Ronnie Brown, Steve Smith and DRC.  It seems like he looks for the biggest name available.  In comparison, look back at when Modrak was here.  He picked up FA players that fit like Darwin Walker, Al Harris, Carlos Emmons, Runyan.  These players fit in and played a solid role for this team for several years

[AceofSpades]

Here's the way I look at it. I'm honestly not really sure how Roseman is as a GM and here's why. Andy Reid has final say on all football matters. With Reid here, Roseman job is to go get the players Andy wants and to make the deals for the players Andy wants. He's gonna get a lot of the blame but people are ignoring the fact that he's still reporting to Andy Reid. For a couple years now I've wondered what type of GM Roseman would be without Andy Reid. Now I do believe that the Eagles will need to bring in a true football executive to take Andy's role as EVP - Football Operations. They've gotta let Smolenski and Roseman handle the business side of the product while the coach and new EVP handle the on field product.

People think Roseman just goes out, gets the players & tells Andy this is who you have to work with. It doesn't work that way especially with Andy here. He tells Howie who he wants, the types of players he wants, and tells Roseman to go make it happen. So I honestly believe that Roseman is only doing what Andy wants to do and isn't really doing what people think he is.

[Sean Jerz]

The TV shot of Howie and Jeff in the box together. I swear those two looked like they were drinking hard for 3 weeks straight..

They looked horrible..

[9thPassyunk]

Roseman has no basis for evaluating talent as he has never played the game, He has no experience. He never was in a Camp. Never went thru a 2-a-Day. Rehabed an injury, Been cut, Made a Team. Read a defense. Jacked up a blocker. Ran for a 1st down...ect Where did his qualifications come from that allowed him to morph from a contract guy into our lead Player Personnel Exec?

The lack of depth and players on this roster falls right at his feet along with Andy. If you are going to throw Andy under the bus, Howie has to go right along with him.

You need a real football man, who has the resume/experience, to come in here and retool this franchise. You need a clean slate to build from with absolutely NO semblance of the prior regime.

[pdmkob]

DonCornelious, on 14 December 2012 - 09:19 AM, said:

It's easy to look back at a draft 12 years ago and say that someone was not good as opposed to looking at someone that is on the roster of a bad team and saying they are good.  So you say someone like Dion Lewis is good, but Ryan Moats was not?  They are the exact same player, in fact look at Moats' career stats, Lewis should be happy if his career numbers end up at the level of Moats. Similarly, look at the numbers between Riley Cooper and someone like Freddy Mitchell.  

Looking back at those drafts, 2002 was by far the best draft during the Reid era.  4 high quality starters (5 if you include Brock, 3 of them pro-bowl players).  I think we will be lucky to get 1 pro-bowl player out of the last 3 drafts.  I have no idea of how much influence Roseman had over the drafts and things like the Washburn signing, but I can say that the talent level on this team is awful.  

One of the big problems I have with Roseman is that I don't think he has an understanding of how a team should be built and knowledge of personnel to understand how players fit in.  I look at the FAs he pushed for and brought in.  These players include NNamdi, Jenkins, Babin, Young, Ronnie Brown, Steve Smith and DRC.  It seems like he looks for the biggest name available.  In comparison, look back at when Modrak was here.  He picked up FA players that fit like Darwin Walker, Al Harris, Carlos Emmons, Runyan.  These players fit in and played a solid role for this team for several years

Agree with the first part but not the bottom


Pinkston, and Freddie Mitchell for that matter (despit being the goat of the fans and this board) contributes more to wins than Steward Bradley ever did. But nobody expected the world fromm Bradley as they wished they had got from a first and second round WR pick for a WR starved team.

Runyan was a no brainer - somebody had to be brought in to nuetralize Strahan.

Al Harris and Emmons were allowed to walk, same with Trotter - i dont know if that was all in Madraks watch.


Howie has given this coach and these fans everything we wished for for years

the locker room and the field effort are not a product of his failing. does he also get credit for keeping Shady and desean here?

I think he **** the bed by jumping the gun instead of franchise tagging Vick.

[italianmafia23]

cb4130, on 14 December 2012 - 05:48 AM, said:

King Dunlap- LOL


Brandon Graham- Over JPP??? LOL

If you followed college football or had any scouting sense, that made perfect sense at the time. Graham was the safe, productive pick. JPP was a physical freak who could do backflips, but had questionable production. Hindsight is 20/20.

[italianmafia23]

9thPassyunk, on 14 December 2012 - 09:30 AM, said:

Roseman has no basis for evaluating talent as he has never played the game, He has no experience. He never was in a Camp. Never went thru a 2-a-Day. Rehabed an injury, Been cut, Made a Team. Read a defense. Jacked up a blocker. Ran for a 1st down...ect Where did his qualifications come from that allowed him to morph from a contract guy into our lead Player Personnel Exec?

Oh, that old chestnut again! XD

[No1BirdsFan]

9thPassyunk, on 14 December 2012 - 09:30 AM, said:

Roseman has no basis for evaluating talent as he has never played the game, He has no experience. He never was in a Camp. Never went thru a 2-a-Day. Rehabed an injury, Been cut, Made a Team. Read a defense. Jacked up a blocker. Ran for a 1st down...ect Where did his qualifications come from that allowed him to morph from a contract guy into our lead Player Personnel Exec?

The lack of depth and players on this roster falls right at his feet along with Andy. If you are going to throw Andy under the bus, Howie has to go right along with him.

You need a real football man, who has the resume/experience, to come in here and retool this franchise. You need a clean slate to build from with absolutely NO semblance of the prior regime.

Spot on

[pgcd3]

The team was 11-5 before he took over then 10-6 then 8-8 now this. The results speak for themselves. The lack of LBs behind the wide-9 last year the obvious problems at safety and OL depth coming into this season. He's a fantasy football guy. He puts names together but they don't amount to a cohesive nfl team.  And if you want to blame Andy for much of this then I'll say what good has Howie done? You don't stick with someone after this debacle unless you are sure they are great. And he is not. More likely he is to blame for much of what has gone wrong

[DawkinsOwnage03]

I would rather have Howie gone than Reid.

[TV Guy]

DawkinsOwnage03, on 14 December 2012 - 10:44 AM, said:

I would rather have Howie gone than Reid.

And that's saying something.

[KzEaglefan86]

He's responsible for the hiring of the divisive Jim Washburn, any draft pick in the last ten seasons that's been bad, he injured our entire starting offensive line, and is behind the nation's poor economy.  Did I miss anything?

[inhumanehuman]

I don't think Howie is to blame, and think he is doing a good job with what he can do. However, I don't think Howie can be relied on if someone like Andy Reid leaves the organization and Howie really has to start being the true GM.

[selassieyouth]

Howie Is the GM.

Andy might have final say on players but he is not scouting, and organizing the players he has final say over.
Andy is not putting every player under a microscope before he chooses them. That is the job of the GM and his scouting staff.

Howie and his scouting staff have filled this team with me first players who wont play special teams


I agree with the poster who said "I dont know who is an Andy pick and who is a Howie pick."

At this point Andy has been a level drafter. Not great, but not totally bad either.
However now we have mixed that with Howie who is just not good at evaluating talent.
Put the two together and we have a serious mess on the field.

I want both of them gone. But Andy has at least an ounce of football knowledge. If I had to choose I would rather Howie get fired than Andy. But I dont want to choose, I just want both of them gone. They are both a part of the problem around here.

Maybe we can convince Mr Lurie to sell the team to TATE, than we would win the Super Bowl every single season. .HAHAHAH

[AceofSpades]

inhumanehuman, on 14 December 2012 - 11:03 AM, said:

I don't think Howie is to blame, and think he is doing a good job with what he can do. However, I don't think Howie can be relied on if someone like Andy Reid leaves the organization and Howie really has to start being the true GM.

This is exactly what I'm saying. I think Roseman can't be the guy in charge but he's doing basically what he's being told to do. I think he needs a true football executive over him and he'd be better off.

selassieyouth, on 14 December 2012 - 11:05 AM, said:

Howie Is the GM.

Andy might have final say on players but he is not scouting, and organizing the players he has final say over.
Andy is not putting every player under a microscope before he chooses them. That is the job of the GM and his scouting staff.

Howie and his scouting staff have filled this team with me first players who wont play special teams


I agree with the poster who said "I dont know who is an Andy pick and who is a Howie pick."

At this point Andy has been a level drafter. Not great, but not totally bad either.
However now we have mixed that with Howie who is just not good at evaluating talent.
Put the two together and we have a serious mess on the field.

I want both of them gone. But Andy has at least an ounce of football knowledge. If I had to choose I would rather Howie get fired than Andy. But I dont want to choose, I just want both of them gone. They are both a part of the problem around here.

Maybe we can convince Mr Lurie to sell the team to TATE, than we would win the Super Bowl every single season. .HAHAHAH

The thing is, Roseman's job is to bring in the players Andy Reid wants. Andy provides the types of players he wants & feels it's Roseman's job to get those guys and that's what's happened. So ultimately Reid is responsible. Howie doesn't just go out, get the players, and tells Reid this is who you're gonna have to deal with. I agree that I want complete changes and I think both should go since Roseman's a Reid guy.

[SirReal]

I hate Howie because he never played football, which means that even though he's been living and breathing Pro football for the past decade, it is impossible for him to ever understand the game as well as someone who played in HS and maybe a small college somewhere.

[inhumanehuman]

AceofSpades, on 14 December 2012 - 11:07 AM, said:

This is exactly what I'm saying. I think Roseman can't be the guy in charge but he's doing basically what he's being told to do. I think he needs a true football executive over him and he'd be better off.

I agree. He doesn't have enough experience to run the front office, and he needs someone over his head checking his moves. I do want him to stick around, because we need level-headed non-football guys in the front office making the numbers work. I think Howie can be the Joe Banner for the Eagles in the future in that respect.

[KzEaglefan86]

selassieyouth, on 14 December 2012 - 11:05 AM, said:

At this point Andy has been a level drafter. Not great, but not totally bad either.
However now we have mixed that with Howie who is just not good at evaluating talent.
Put the two together and we have a serious mess on the field.

Except that, if we are talking about scouting/player evaluations, all indications are that this draft has the potential to be the best of the entire Reid era.

I also think it's important to keep everything in perspective.  People are talking about this roster as if it's an abomination.  As if we need to release everyone on the team and start over with an entirely new roster.  Ponder, for a moment, what we'd be talking about if we weren't playing with a practice squad offensive line.  We'd probably be talking about a potential playoff birth and a chance at a division crown in a fairly weak NFC East.  There's a chance we'd be talking about how many years Reid might get on a contract extension.

[italianmafia23]

DawkinsOwnage03, on 14 December 2012 - 10:44 AM, said:

I would rather have Howie gone than Reid.

You must not pay attention.

[joespadaro]

I wouldnt have Reggie Brown in the green and not Pinkston, Pinkston > Reggie Brown