68 replies to this topic

[E-A-G-L-E-S Eagles]

What exactly has he done for everyone to simply overlook his role in this debacle?  I can't think of any one thing.  Yet, his rise up the food chain has also matched our drop from a quality program.

I don't think AR is free and clear, but I think this situation needs shared with the Boy Wonder, too.  I know Reid is the one on TV and in the press conferences, but this organization has some significant dysfunction that is bigger than one man.

Someone, please educate me.

[kb420]

E-A-G-L-E-S Eagles, on 15 December 2012 - 06:30 AM, said:

What exactly has he done for everyone to simply overlook his role in this debacle?  I can't think of any one thing.  Yet, his rise up the food chain has also matched our drop from a quality program.

I don't think AR is free and clear, but I think this situation needs shared with the Boy Wonder, too.  I know Reid is the one on TV and in the press conferences, but this organization has some significant dysfunction that is bigger than one man.

Someone, please educate me.

I'm not sure what Howie Roseman's contributions to this fiasco have been.  It was rumored that he was the one who suggested that Jim Washburn be hired as the defensive line coach,  but he released a statement to the press that said ultimately that was Reid's decision.  What moves has Roseman been responsible for?  What has he actually done?  Does anyone outside of the organization really know?

The only thing that's certain is that he will be here another 4 years.

[TenaciousEagles]

It was rumored that Roseman convinced Reid to draft Graham over JPP (Reid was a HUGE JPP fan).  And by "rumored" I mean it was 100% fact.

[djbigf]

i wouldn't be so sure...apparently he was ranting and raving to lurie over a bad call thurs nite and lurie just sat there stonefaced...i think lurie's keeping mum b/c he knows that a total top-to-bottom housecleaning is in order.

[time2rock]

Who here is giving Howie a 'free pass' ?  Judging by the posts here, most want him gone along with the rest.

[bckarpman1]

I agree CLEAN HOUSE!!!

[bckarpman1]

Its like one of those hoarder shows on tv, you can't go in and just clean a couple of rooms, you have to take all the crap to the dumpster.

[DonCornelious]

bckarpman1, on 15 December 2012 - 08:58 AM, said:

Its like one of those hoarder shows on tv, you can't go in and just clean a couple of rooms, you have to take all the crap to the dumpster.

So in this scenario is Lurie the 70yo woman who sleeps in a barkolounger, surrounded by crates filled with dirty laundry while cats piss all over her belongings?

[italianmafia23]

TenaciousEagles, on 15 December 2012 - 08:34 AM, said:

It was rumored that Roseman convinced Reid to draft Graham over JPP (Reid was a HUGE JPP fan).  And by "rumored" I mean it was 100% fact.

Lol! 100% fact, huh? Care to share your definitive source? Graham was certainly the smarter choice at the time. He had consistent, top level production his whole college career with no injury history and was MVP of the Senior Bowl. JPP was just a physical freak who could do backflips who had limited experience and spotty production. Big-time boom or bust. Nobody could have foreseen Graham's injury. They had virtually identical stats the week of Graham's injury at the end of their rookie seasons. Brandon Graham has been even better than JPP in half the snaps this season in his first real season back from ACL/microfracture surgery. So I don't see how your argument even works, even if it was true.

[bumpy93]

bckarpman1, on 15 December 2012 - 08:53 AM, said:

I agree CLEAN HOUSE!!!

AGREE.......

Its time to start anew. Thats means EVERYTHING IMO

A few players should be safe

Shady
Djax
Cox
Graham
Ryans
Kendricks
Foles

They should be the only players that are 100% returning to the team in 2013 UNLESS another team comes in and blows the Eagles away in a trade for one of them.

[italianmafia23]

Roseman handles trades and contracts. Those areas have been stellar, outside of Asante's trade and Mike Patterson's treatment.

[The_Talon]

any of them get a free pass because none of us are involved in the decision making process.

[djbigf]

italianmafia23, on 15 December 2012 - 12:35 PM, said:

Roseman handles trades and contracts. Those areas have been stellar, outside of Asante's trade and Mike Patterson's treatment.

he also runs the scouting department that was responsible for the drafting of fireman dan

[italianmafia23]

djbigf, on 15 December 2012 - 12:37 PM, said:

he also runs the scouting department that was responsible for the drafting of fireman dan

You're really gonna try that **** after the draft we just had? LOL! Fail.

[GrahamCracker]

wormtongue

[Solomon]

TenaciousEagles, on 15 December 2012 - 08:34 AM, said:

It was rumored that Roseman convinced Reid to draft Graham over JPP (Reid was a HUGE JPP fan).  And by "rumored" I mean it was 100% fact.

And by "fact" you mean "opinion".

[djbigf]

italianmafia23, on 15 December 2012 - 12:39 PM, said:

You're really gonna try that **** after the draft we just had? LOL! Fail.

kendricks is a bum

[italianmafia23]

djbigf, on 15 December 2012 - 01:12 PM, said:

kendricks is a bum

Even if he was a bum -- what about Cox? Curry? Foles? Bryce Brown for a 7th round pick? You sound like somebody that doesn't follow the draft very closely at all. For me, it's one of my favorite aspects of pro football period. Do you even have the slightest clue what draft success rates are for even the best drafting football teams?

[djbigf]

italianmafia23, on 15 December 2012 - 01:17 PM, said:

Even if he was a bum -- what about Cox? Curry? Foles?

hooray, he didn't blow his 1st round pick for the 1st time in 3 years!

curry?  who's that?  does he even play?

foles = bobby hoying

Quote

Bryce Brown for a 7th round pick?

ryan moats w/ a little more bulk.  BFD.

[italianmafia23]

djbigf, on 15 December 2012 - 01:22 PM, said:

hooray, they didn't blow a 1st round pick for the 1st time in 3 years!

Oh yeah, I forgot how Brandon Graham is still a bust!

Quote

curry?  who's that?  does he even play?

Who's that? Lol, I think that pretty much confirms my suspicions. Our other 2nd round pick. He looked good in the preseason, but didn't get playing time buried on the depth chart until recently with the release of Babin, and already ranks in the top 50 (44 -- Umenyiora is 38) at DE in the entire league according to PFF on just 72 snaps. Keep in mind, there are 64 starting DE's in the NFL, and he's not even one of them yet.

Quote

foles = bobby hoying

Could be. But for now he has played well given the circumstances, and for that he deserves credit. Nobody expects much out of a QB not drafted in the 1st round. They almost never pan out.

Quote

ryan moats w/ a little more bulk.  BFD.

Ryan Moats never got playing time because he couldn't pass block. Brown had 2 of the best starts for a rookie in NFL history, but he's still garbage in your eyes!


It's clear you're just being overly cynical to cover your a** now, though. I find that pretty funny!

[BayAreaLennie]

Solomon, on 15 December 2012 - 01:08 PM, said:

And by "fact" you mean "opinion".

No, he meant "speculation".

[inhumanehuman]

What can anyone say with certainty Howie Roseman has done on his own volition that has hurt this organization? We don't know, and we won't know until Howie actually gets the control a typical GM does. Andy makes the final call on personnel, not Howie.

The only thing I've seen him do is go out and find a way to get/sign/extend every single player Andy Reid wanted without hesitation. I don't think Howie is that bad of a GM, and he darn sure isn't the problem with the football team.

[Netherscourge]

E-A-G-L-E-S Eagles, on 15 December 2012 - 06:30 AM, said:

What exactly has he done for everyone to simply overlook his role in this debacle?  I can't think of any one thing.  Yet, his rise up the food chain has also matched our drop from a quality program.

I don't think AR is free and clear, but I think this situation needs shared with the Boy Wonder, too.  I know Reid is the one on TV and in the press conferences, but this organization has some significant dysfunction that is bigger than one man.

Someone, please educate me.

Overlooked? He's like 75% responsible for this train wreck! His first two drafts netted us garbage.

[RedZoneD25]

italianmafia23, on 15 December 2012 - 12:39 PM, said:

You're really gonna try that **** after the draft we just had? LOL! Fail.

Why is it invalid because Howie did the right thing one year out of a potential three Drafts? That's still 2/3rds a toilet full of ****.

[italianmafia23]

RedZoneD25, on 15 December 2012 - 08:30 PM, said:

Why is it invalid because Howie did the right thing one year out of a potential three Drafts? That's still 2/3rds a toilet full of ****.

Because it's NOT a valid statement to say he did the right thing only once in three years.

2010: Brandon Graham
2011: Danny Watkins
2012: Fletcher Cox

[FanSinceWayBack]

E-A-G-L-E-S Eagles, on 15 December 2012 - 06:30 AM, said:

What exactly has he done for everyone to simply overlook his role in this debacle?  I can't think of any one thing.


Someone, please educate me.

Other than the 2002 draft. Which draft class beats last years?  

Im not saying Howie had the credentials to "earn" the job. Im just looking at facts.


If you wanna looks at draft classes from the time Reid arrived until this past draft, here you go.... Take a gander http://boards.philad...roseman-is-bad/

How can anyone argue about his negotiation and contract skills?
I dont care for D.Jackson much, but I understand his value and why people/coaches would like him. We got him under contract
What about McCoy?
What about Cole? Who predicted he would fall off, after last seasons performance?
Babin and Washburn looked like good additions last year, or did they not?
This year for what ever reason it didnt work and now there gone. Its not like they were lingering around this franchise for 3-4 years...

I just dont understand all ( I get some of it) the criticism that gets directed to a guy who people really only speculate about. AR has so much control over this franchise its hard for me to point a finger at anyone but him. He assembled this staff and has final say so over pretty much everything.

Why is everyone so opposed to seeing Howie, just for 1 year, without AR over his and everyone elses shoulder?

Howie is the youngest GM in the NFL and although many think if you have never played the game then its impossible to amount to anything successful. I dont believe that. I think it most certainly helps, but I dont buy that you cant be successful if you've never played. I dont have examples, but Im sure there are some.

My point is Howie had a great draft last year and he fills voids with players that didnt get addressed in the draft or with players that arent getting addressed in the draft.

Outside of 2002 someone please tell me how Banner/Heckert were all mighty ones when it came to drafting?

Jerry Reese is 49
Ozzie Newsome is 56
Howie Roseman is 37

[Excel]

italianmafia23, on 15 December 2012 - 12:32 PM, said:

Lol! 100% fact, huh? Care to share your definitive source? Graham was certainly the smarter choice at the time. He had consistent, top level production his whole college career with no injury history and was MVP of the Senior Bowl. JPP was just a physical freak who could do backflips who had limited experience and spotty production. Big-time boom or bust. Nobody could have foreseen Graham's injury. They had virtually identical stats the week of Graham's injury at the end of their rookie seasons. Brandon Graham has been even better than JPP in half the snaps this season in his first real season back from ACL/microfracture surgery. So I don't see how your argument even works, even if it was true.

It is a fact Andy Reid loved JPP. it's also a fact he absolutely loved Brandon Graham. So you can pick what you want to believe.

[700level4life]

djbigf, on 15 December 2012 - 01:12 PM, said:

kendricks is a bum

.

[Runtherock]

This is the most poorly coached team in the league. That's why Reid is the focus. The jury is still out on Howie, some poor early draft picks, but so so far this draft looks good and even Graham, of all things, is actually showing something. There is no question about the coaching, horrific.

[pgcd3]

Graham is in year 3 and they gave up a lot or him. His output to date is subpar. If it turns out he's nearly as good ad JPP in the final year of his rookie deal that doesn't get you your 3 years back

Cox wad a no brainer pick. The dumbest person on this board could have made that one.

He might be good on contracts but that's not a guy you want making football decisions.

Basically the team has been terrible since he became GM and while Reid is mostly to blame its almost impossible to suggest Howie wasn't a part of the problem.