262 replies to this topic

[rich36]

So there are some prevailing thoughts on BBI regarding what JR may do with Cruz. As you know, he has a 1st round tender. The guys there were saying they could see a situation where someone could, in an otherwise weak draft, sign him for their 1st rounder..The teams with $$ to burn those guys are leery of are Miami (major hispanic community; he'd be a God there), Tampa (he'd seamlessly fit into Sulluvan's offense because it's the Giants O), New England (may lose Welker and Belichick may go for broke on his/Brady's final few years), and Indy (major $$ under the cap). Now, the debate there is if it's Tampa or Miami (#'s 12 and 13 in the draft) do you say "good-bye" to Cruz? What about if it's Indy or New England? Me? I'd let him go to Miami or Tampa. Keep our #19 and essentially have 3 picks in the top 50 (12/13; 19, and 50)...give Reese that type of amo and who knows what the man is capable of...Curious to get your thoughts...

[BKLYNYG]

Disagree Rich. I'd like to keep Cruz. He's not only a productive player, but he has a great attitude and is a fan favorite. Just pay him his money.

[MightyJNC]

Regardless of what they "think at BBI" (man talk about an oxymoron), I would have to put the Rams at the head of the list since they have 2 1st rounders, an abundance of CAP space and such a glaring hole at WR that they just recently took a flyer on T Young.

[rich36]

BKLYNYG, on 15 February 2013 - 03:14 PM, said:

Disagree Rich. I'd like to keep Cruz. He's not only a productive player, but he has a great attitude and is a fan favorite. Just pay him his money.

Fair point, no doubt. Here's why I do it: You get the sense Reese is wanting to transition from one championship cycle to the next (much like what Parcells said about the 1986 Niners who were re-tooling from 81/84 to 88/89). We're in that middle stage where the team is a work in progress. This would be an incredible opportunity for a GM of Reese's abilty to retool in a similar way...

[rich36]

MightyJNC, on 15 February 2013 - 03:23 PM, said:

Regardless of what they "think at BBI" (man talk about an oxymoron), I would have to put the Rams at the head of the list since they have 2 1st rounders, an abundance of CAP space and such a glaring hole at WR that they just recently took a flyer on T Young.

Remember, Cruz would have a say in this as well and would he see St. Louis as attractive as say Miami (if they make a run at him)....not sure...BUT, I'd take #16

[Gmen4ever]

When a guy like Cruz winds up on your roster, undrafted, you hang onto him. As much as Nicks is the undisputed go to guy, we dont know how he's going to hold up physically, due to his injuries.

Vic is a proven talent. Getting an extra 1st would be great, but what if that pick turns out to be along the lines of William Joseph? For that reason alone, I say pay Cruz.

[rich36]

Gmen4ever, on 15 February 2013 - 03:35 PM, said:

When a guy like Cruz winds up on your roster, undrafted, you hang onto him. As much as Nicks is the undisputed go to guy, we dont know how he's going to hold up physically, due to his injuries.

Vic is a proven talent. Getting an extra 1st would be great, but what if that pick turns out to be along the lines of William Joseph? For that reason alone, I say pay Cruz.

Funny..you and BK make good points. I find myself agreeing with the guys on BBI, who mostly say let him walk simply to give Reese the amo to solidify the team this year in a major way...You can get a top OT or OG with that pick, which would go a long way to rebuilding that OL...in addition, you keep your pick and you can get a CB or S or trade down...the possibilities are endless...plus, what 1st rounder has Reese bombed? None. Even Aaron Ross, who I hated at the time, worked out while he was here...

[MightyJNC]

rich36, on 15 February 2013 - 03:27 PM, said:

Remember, Cruz would have a say in this as well and would he see St. Louis as attractive as say Miami (if they make a run at him)....not sure...BUT, I'd take #16

While I'm sure he would consider certain destinations more attractive than others (an anyone would), I don't believe geography would even factor into it if a team were to absolutely blow him away with a top-5 WR level deal but if the $ were comparable then yeah.

However if they allow, or are unable to prevent him from walking, that would be an extremely risky move because of the always present, very real possibility of Nicks breaking down again and if that were to happen and regardless of what they may get with the pick, that would essentially leave them with 2nd-year Randle, Jerrigan and possibly a rookie at WR which would be suicide for a team that lives and dies by the pass.

[rich36]

MightyJNC, on 15 February 2013 - 03:53 PM, said:

While I'm sure he would consider certain destinations more attractive than others (an anyone would), I don't believe geography would even factor into it if a team were to absolutely blow him away with a top-5 WR level deal but if they $ were comparable then yeah.

However if they allow, or are unable to prevent him from walking, that would be an extremely risky move because of the always present, very real possibility of Nicks breaking down again and if that were to happen and regardless of what they may get with the pick, that would essentially leave them with 2nd-year Randle, Jerrigan and possibly a rookie at WR which would be suicide for a team that lives and dies by the pass.

An agreeable risk, no doubt, especially the rookie WR part trying to grasp TC's offense which is known as one of the more complex in the league. He's essentially be red-shirted in year 1. I'm sure this is something Reese, Coughlin and the staff have all discussed quite a bit these last few weeks...they'd have to decide if it's worth sacrificing short term year if the payoff is to field champioship level teams over the last 3-4 years of Manning's career...

[MightyJNC]

rich36, on 15 February 2013 - 03:58 PM, said:

An agreeable risk, no doubt, especially the rookie WR part trying to grasp TC's offense which is known as one of the more complex in the league. He's essentially be red-shirted in year 1. I'm sure this is something Reese, Coughlin and the staff have all discussed quite a bit these last few weeks...they'd have to decide if it's worth sacrificing short term year if the payoff is to field champioship level teams over the last 3-4 years of Manning's career...

And exactly why would having 2 1st rd picks this year at the cost of creating a glaring hole at WR (that just maybe a 13' rookie WR is capable of filling in 14' or 15') make that anymore of a realistic possibility, vs. having 1 1st rd pick this year and a proven commodity in Cruz locked up long-term?    

If they've got Cruz, why not just use this years 1st to fill 1 significant need say OL, and next year's 1st to fill another and so wouldn't that actually have them in better shape going into Corky's last couple of seasons because there is no guarantee that any drafted WR would ever play up to Cruz' level?

[MacGyver1]

rich36, on 15 February 2013 - 02:58 PM, said:

So there are some prevailing thoughts on BBI regarding what JR may do with Cruz. As you know, he has a 1st round tender. The guys there were saying they could see a situation where someone could, in an otherwise weak draft, sign him for their 1st rounder..The teams with $$ to burn those guys are leery of are Miami (major hispanic community; he'd be a God there), Tampa (he'd seamlessly fit into Sulluvan's offense because it's the Giants O), New England (may lose Welker and Belichick may go for broke on his/Brady's final few years), and Indy (major $$ under the cap). Now, the debate there is if it's Tampa or Miami (#'s 12 and 13 in the draft) do you say "good-bye" to Cruz? What about if it's Indy or New England? Me? I'd let him go to Miami or Tampa. Keep our #19 and essentially have 3 picks in the top 50 (12/13; 19, and 50)...give Reese that type of amo and who knows what the man is capable of...Curious to get your thoughts...

Hi, I have a thought. The Giants are going to suck for years to come, how's that?

[blakjak]

I'd keep him for the following reasons:

Nicks health concerns
Randle showed flashes late last year but thats it.
Jernigan has done absolutley nothing. Dude never sees the field.

Whats a pick this year going to do. Both OL and WR typically sit the first few years in Coughin's offense. Even if we hit a homerun on that pick, we wouldnt see any gain until at least year 2.

Even with Nicks/Cruz on the roster we dont have a proven 3rd wide out IMO. Given the shake up in the backfield, I'd want some continuity in the WR group.


I'm gonna get flamed here but so be it.  If Reese wants to win a 3rd ring before Eli hangs it up they go out and get Harvin this year and resign Cruz and Nicks.  Bet the farm. Who gives a crap what the D looks like. With those 3 wideouts we can hang 40 on almost anyone.

Chaaaaampiiooonshiiiiip!

[Happyfoosball]

I've said from the start it's either going to be Cruz or Nicks.  They won't be able to afford both.  I think Cruz is the obvious choice because he's shown the ability to stay healthy.  Remember, JPP is going to want to be paid in the next couple of years,  the reality is the Giants can't sign everyone.  Especially when other teams are willing to overpay for their players.  I mean we see it year in and year out.

[QuinnWR4]

As much as I'd like to see Cruz off the Giants roster, I wouldn't want to trade a proven stud for an unknown draft pick. Even if it is a first rounder.

[pencil face]

Nicks, JPP, and Cruz, one of these guys are out, no way the Giants keep them all with the current cap situation, and since Cruz is the first guy up I think he's gone...

[DawkinsOwnage03]

Ill take Cruz

[DonB.Shadow1]

My thing is JR has let too many players leave and not gotten anything for them, and that's not entirely his fault it's just the way things shake out with players be restricted or un - restricted.  If Cruz leaves or is traded I hope the Giants get fair compensation for him because his stock is very, very, high right now.

[MightyJNC]

Really looks like you (and the rest of the deep-thinkers over at BBI) are batting your typical average (would need a 50 ft extension ladder to sniff the Mendoza line) on this one ricky.

Here's a novel idea you might just want to try at least once, actually formulate your own opinion based on observation and analysis as opposed to just so enthusiastically swallowing every hare-brained bit of ill-conceived drivel you read over there hook, line and sinker and then regurgitating it over here.

[Gmen4ever]

MightyJNC, on 18 February 2013 - 05:05 PM, said:

Really looks like you (and the rest of the deep-thinkers over at BBI) are batting your typical average (would need a 50 ft extension ladder to sniff the Mendoza line) on this one ricky.

Here's a novel idea you might just want to try at least once, actually formulate your own opinion based on observation and analysis as opposed to just so enthusiastically swallowing every hare-brained bit of ill-conceived drivel you read over there hook, line and sinker and then regurgitating it over here.

Remember that the next time you post a quote or a link from an outside source regarding the Eagles, or any other NFL team. He was addressing Giants fans and asking for opinions from us, so why ruin a perfectly civil thread by starting ish for no reason? You've posted plenty of links and quotes from other sites. Rich didn't do that in this thread. He started a thread to get some conversation going about the Giants. I dont expect you to understand, because reasoning with you is like talking to a 50 ft brick wall, but theres no reason to do what you're attempting to do.

Quite frankly, even I dont engage you in that way anymore because it's gotten way beyond boring. Just walk away and leave it alone.

[rich36]

Gmen4ever, on 18 February 2013 - 09:38 PM, said:

Remember that the next time you post a quote or a link from an outside source regarding the Eagles, or any other NFL team. He was addressing Giants fans and asking for opinions from us, so why ruin a perfectly civil thread by starting ish for no reason? You've posted plenty of links and quotes from other sites. Rich didn't do that in this thread. He started a thread to get some conversation going about the Giants. I dont expect you to understand, because reasoning with you is like talking to a 50 ft brick wall, but theres no reason to do what you're attempting to do.

Quite frankly, even I dont engage you in that way anymore because it's gotten way beyond boring. Just walk away and leave it alone.

It's all about his jealousy about the team mentioned in the topic of the thread...face it, he has 2 choices: bash us or talk about how much his team sucks and will continue to suck, most likely, going fwrd...which do you think he's going to choose?

[rich36]

Anyway, back to the topic at hand. Looks like I am in the minority with this, which is fine...all this is is a hypothetical situation (where a predictable **** took it a step too far, but it is what it is with that clown, we all know who I am talking about)..I still think that if a team picking before 19 wants Cruz for what Cruz is looking for, I'd let him walk..if it's someone picking in the mid to late 20's (Indy/New England), I'd re-sign him unless the $$ is so outrageous, re-signing him would "destroy" the cap...in the end, though, I think Cruz comes back at about $7-8MM a year..

[MightyJNC]

Gmen4ever, on 18 February 2013 - 09:38 PM, said:

Remember that the next time you post a quote or a link from an outside source regarding the Eagles, or any other NFL team.

When I reference information from outside sources they are always from recognized professional sports media outlets, team beat writers, FO/coaches/player interviews, etc (i.e. "credible sources" with actual access to the team(s)), not from some joke website where all of the content is written and edited by some jersey sack-gargler named "Eric from Binghampton NY" who has never played even college, let alone professional sports or ever been employed by any profesional sports franchise or media outlet in any capacity in his life.

Gmen4ever, on 18 February 2013 - 09:38 PM, said:

He was addressing Giants fans and asking for opinions from us, so why ruin a perfectly civil thread by starting ish for no reason? You've posted plenty of links and quotes from other sites. Rich didn't do that in this thread. He started a thread to get some conversation going about the Giants. I dont expect you to understand, because reasoning with you is like talking to a 50 ft brick wall, but theres no reason to do what you're attempting to do.

My, my what a different tune some jerey fans whistle when the shoe is on the other foot. Why? Because "what is good for the goose should be good for the gander" so if little ricky doesn't like it and doesn't want it to happen when jersey fans are attempting to have "a perfectly civil conversation" then he (or any of the rest) either shouldn't don't do it and especially shouldn't cry when it happens to them.  

Gmen4ever, on 18 February 2013 - 09:38 PM, said:

Quite frankly, even I dont engage you in that way anymore because it's gotten way beyond boring. Just walk away and leave it alone.

No, that's not why and you know it, so if I was you "i'd just walk away and leave this one alone".

[MightyJNC]

rich36, on 19 February 2013 - 08:32 AM, said:

I still think that if a team picking before 19 wants Cruz for what Cruz is looking for, I'd let him walk..

MightyJNC, on 15 February 2013 - 04:22 PM, said:

And exactly why would having 2 1st rd picks this year at the cost of creating a glaring hole at WR (that just maybe a 13' rookie WR is capable of filling in 14' or 15') make that anymore of a realistic possibility, vs. having 1 1st rd pick this year and a proven commodity in Cruz locked up long-term?

If they've got Cruz, why not just use this years 1st to fill 1 significant need say OL, and next year's 1st to fill another and so wouldn't that actually have them in better shape going into Corky's last couple of seasons because there is no guarantee that any drafted WR would ever play up to Cruz' level?

[rich36]

MightyJNC, on 19 February 2013 - 09:18 AM, said:

When I reference information from outside sources they are always from recognized professional sports media outlets, team beat writers, FO/coaches/player interviews, etc (i.e. "credible sources" with actual access to the team(s)), not from some joke website where all of the content is written and edited by some jersey sack-gargler named "Eric from Binghampton NY" who has never played even college, let alone professional sports or ever been employed by any profesional sports franchise or media outlet in any capacity in his life.



My, my what a different tune some jerey fans whistle when the shoe is on the other foot. Why? Because "what is good for the goose should be good for the gander" so if little ricky doesn't like it and doesn't want it to happen when jersey fans are attempting to have "a perfectly civil conversation" then he (or any of the rest) either shouldn't don't do it and especially shouldn't cry when it happens to them.  



No, that's not why and you know it, so if I was you "i'd just walk away and leave this one alone".

Really??? Eric was a journalist in NY/NJ covering the team before family obligations forced him to move to Virginia..and, while working here, had quite a few credible sources within the NYG FO..now he runs a CREDIBLE NYG centric website CURRENT beat writers visit/reference all the time like MG and Vacchiano? These guys even partake in Q&A sessions on the site...why do you think I keep referencing the email he posted the day after the draft about David Wilson being their #1 guy all along everytime you or some other lunkhead says the Bucs "stole" Doug Martin from the Giants??? What a total @ss you are....

[MightyJNC]

rich36, on 19 February 2013 - 09:57 AM, said:

Really??? Eric was a journalist in NY/NJ covering the team before family obligations forced him to move to Virginia..and, while working here, had quite a few credible sources within the NYG FO...why do you think I keep referencing the email he posted the day after the draft about David Wilson being their #1 guy all along everytime you or some other lunkhead says the Bucs "stole" Doug Martin from the Giants??? What a total @ss you are....

Really???  Sure he was. Did he tell you that in the chatroom or is this just more total BS you're pulling out of your arse to save face?

Then you would think that if good ole' Eric actually had anything even remotely close to those professional credentials he would mention them in his bio on BBI instead of ish about being a WWII and Civil War buff.  Freakin geek probably used to do the reenactments but quit when they wouldn't let him be General Grant.   

Who is Eric?
"Aside from serving as president and senior editor of BigBlueInteractive.com, Eric works as an international trade specialist for an export promotion organization in the mid-Atlantic region. Eric was raised in Binghamton and Waterville, New York. He is a graduate of the School of International Service at the American University with degrees in international relations and economics. Other interests include the history of the Second World War (particularly the European Theater) and The Civil War. Eric is married and has two children."

How curious that there is no mention of his past journalism career covering the team.

[rich36]

MightyJNC, on 19 February 2013 - 10:12 AM, said:

Really???  Sure he was. Did he tell you that in the chatroom or is this just more total BS you're pulling out of your arse to save face?

Then you would think that if good ole' Eric actually had anything even remotely close to those professional credentials he would mention them in his bio on BBI instead of ish about being a WWII and Civil War buff.  Freakin geek probably used to do the reenactments but quit when they wouldn't let him be General Grant.   

Who is Eric?
"Aside from serving as president and senior editor of BigBlueInteractive.com, Eric works as an international trade specialist for an export promotion organization in the mid-Atlantic region. Eric was raised in Binghamton and Waterville, New York. He is a graduate of the School of International Service at the American University with degrees in international relations and economics. Other interests include the history of the Second World War (particularly the European Theater) and The Civil War. Eric is married and has two children."

How curious that there is no mention of his past journalism career covering the team.

Again..the dude has credible contacts within the Giants...his website is very much recognized by beat writers, Pat Hanlon, and Bob Papa as 100% legit (they talk about it constantly on giants.com)..the a/v guy who runs video section on giants.com (nilay shay) ALWAYS posts on the site regarding new videos..Joe Skiba, NYG equipment manager, does as well....you believe whatever you want...but to say Bigblueinteractive is a horse**** site is just another example, in a long list of occurrences, of you being a dooosh...

[MightyJNC]

rich36, on 19 February 2013 - 10:20 AM, said:

Again..the dude has credible contacts within the Giants...his website is very much recognized by beat writers, Pat Hanlon, and Bob Papa as 100% legit (they talk about it constantly on giants.com)..the a/v guy who runs video section on giants.com (nilay shay) ALWAYS posts on the site regarding new videos..Joe Skiba, NYG equipment manager, does as well....you believe whatever you want...but to say Bigblueinteractive is a horse**** site is just another example, in a long list of occurrences, of you being a dooosh...

So the undeniable truth is that Eric is not, and never has been "a journalist in NY/NJ covering the team" as you said, and if the site is so "credible" why did you feel the need to blatantly falsify his professional credentials here by portraying him as such?

Dance little monkey, dance!

[rich36]

MightyJNC, on 19 February 2013 - 10:32 AM, said:

So the undeniable truth is that Eric is not, and never has been "a journalist in NY/NJ covering the team" as you said, and if the site is so "credible" why did you feel the need to blatantly falsify his professional credentials here by portraying him as such?

Dance little monkey, dance!

Email the guy and ask him why that's not in his bio..I think the dude had his press credentials revoked for some reason, from what I was told...maybe he doesn't want it in his bio? Again, email the guy..register as an Eagle fan/dooosh 1st on BBI...
Anyway, if I knew my team was gonna suck, like I am sure you have come to that realization already, I guess I'd try to destroy any thread regarding my closest division rival...pretty sad if you ask me...

[MightyJNC]

rich36, on 19 February 2013 - 10:35 AM, said:

Email the guy and ask him why that's not in his bio..I think the dude had his press credentials revoked for some reason, from what I was told...maybe he doesn't want it in his bio? Again, email the guy..register as an Eagle fan/dooosh 1st on BBI...
Anyway, if I knew my team was gonna suck, like I am sure you have come to that realization already, I guess I'd try to destroy any thread regarding my closest division rival...pretty sad if you ask me...

You can't revoke what never existed.

So either keep dancing you FOS little monkey or just admit that you completely made that ish up and I'll let you off the hook, maybe.

[rich36]

MightyJNC, on 19 February 2013 - 10:41 AM, said:

You can't revoke what never existed.

So either keep dancing you FOS little monkey or just admit that you completely made that ish up and I'll let you off the hook, maybe.

Not making stuff up...repeating what I was told by someone else who posts on that site...again, email the dude to clarify his deal..
Anyway, what does his bio have to do with this thread? It's a hypothetical question posed to intelligent Giant fans on here..last I checked, you were neither intelligent nor a NYG fan