Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
DaveSpadaro

[News] Franchise QB, Moves Promote Optimism

713 posts in this topic

  1 hour ago, GreenbleedinFL said:

LMAO,how many QB's have they had that stunk up the place??? They draft one every year

Not 100% positive,but I saw a debate on 'Total Access' the other week about that and if I recall correctly it was said that they had 26 different Starters since returning to Cleveland.

Sounds about right,so how ya gonna build a team like that??? HAHA morons

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  1 hour ago, GreenbleedinFL said:

LMAO,how many QB's have they had that stunk up the place??? They draft one every year

:lol: LMAO, Kessler will be Browns’ 26th starting quarterback since 1999.

Here’s the full list of Browns quarterbacks since they re-entered the league as an expansion team in 1999: Tim Couch, Ty Detmer, Doug Pederson, Spergon Wynn, Kelly Holcomb, Jeff Garcia, Luke McCown, Trent Dilfer, Charlie Frye, Derek Anderson, Ken Dorsey, Brady Quinn, Bruce Gradkowski, Colt McCoy, Jake Delhomme, Seneca Wallace, Brandon Weeden, Thaddeus Lewis, Jason Campbell, Brian Hoyer, Johnny Manziel, Connor Shaw, Josh McCown, Austin Davis, Robert Griffin III, Cody Kessler.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/09/19/kessler-will-be-browns-26th-starting-quarterback-since-1999/

Great place to go ifn you want a BU QB lol

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pats' system is to draft a QB every other yr. Seems to work - they have "2 starters". QB rich must be nice.

Nice to have the weaponry for whomever!!! I would look good with those guys(ok so that's a stretch lol)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  38 minutes ago, mjkline1958 said:

Pats' system is to draft a QB every other yr. Seems to work - they have "2 starters". QB rich must be nice.

They've done just about everything the right way for how many years now? I respect them,but I'm SO SICK of hearing about them and watching them dominate! I guess u could say that I'm outrageously jealous.

Bellicheat knows how to keep that pipeline flowing.We're on the way towards that,gotta build a TEAM first,then you start building your pipeline of "futures"

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You're sick of them - look where I live, lol! I proudly wear my Eagles gear, all Kelly green.

I'd consider moving HAHAHA

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

1Wrangler writes, "@Mr. Simpson, I haven't read anything yet on the Eagles possibly trading back in the first round. I have read that they could possibly trade back in the second round."

Trading back in the second would be a mistake, IMO. First, they won't get as much in return as they would by trading back in the 1st round (& yet would still be able to get an elite CB prospect later in the 1st round). And secondly, there are many promising players projected to go in the 2nd & 3rd round of this year's draft--so the more picks the Eagles can get in the 2nd (& 3rd), the better for their future. Every NFL team *knows* there's a glut of super promising cornerbacks (& safeties) in this year's draft, so I expect the very best prospects will be *heavily* taken off the board in the first 2-3 rounds. Which means the Eagles can't afford to sit back & wait like they did in free agency (at cornerback). They'll have to be more aggressive.

That's why I think it would be smart to trade for an extra 2nd round pick prior to the draft (by trading Kelce, since we presently have three centers), so that the Eagles would have the option to acquire a non-cornerback in the 2nd round--such as RB Joe Mixon (or DE Barnett or LB Foster or WR Davis in the 1st). In fact, I'd like to see them do everything they can to acquire *two* additional 2nd round picks this year (trade back in #1, trade Kelce, Kendricks, JMatt--whatever it takes), since that's where I see the heart of this draft. Acquiring two cornerbacks and two non-cornerbacks in the the first two rounds makes a lot of sense, if possible, since it's such an important draft year for this team's future, more so than usual.

GreenbleedinFL--Of course, you may be right that Mixon's "a head case", considering the violent nature of his past incident, but I was impressed by his December 2016 "apology" press conference. Apparently, the hundreds of hours of counseling that Mixon received (& sought out) has helped him to get his head straight, and I now see him as a once confused kid that has turned himself around. I expect this transformation will become more evident during Mixon's first year in the NFL. Don't forget, Mixon was only 18 years old when the incident occurred, and there's been nothing since. He also had a strong, close bond with his fellow teammates in college, where he had a terrific locker room & on field presence, & was a team leader. So I suspect you may be wrong about the negativity he might bring to the Eagles locker room. Nor do I see him as a head case on the field either--not like Agholor--since he's unquestionably a very good football player, arguably the most versatile RB in the draft.

senhorcook writes, "But Simpson, given your own words, how are the Eagles going to completely redo the defense "(CB, RB, DE, & LB (& possibly S & WR)" and compete this year? CB, DE, LB, and possibly S is the whole defense minus Fletcher Cox. That's needing a perfect draft for a team that drafted horribly in the Chipper years."

Fortunately, the Chipper won't be drafting for us, so there's hope. ;-) No, I don't think they have to "completely redo the defense"--at least, not the starting line up, for the most part, except at the cornerback position. Which can be done. The Falcons had several rookies starting in their secondary last year, and they were certainly competitive. In my view, on defense, the Eagles need to draft 1 LB (or 2 if they trade Kendricks) (either Foster, T.J. Watt, Demarcus Walker, Jaylen-Reeves Maybin), 1 DE (Derek Barnett, Demarcus Walker, Jordan Willis, or the guy from Villanova), 3 CBs (Humphrey, & either K. King, Awuzie, Jackson, Moreau, Tankersley or Lewis, & Lampkin), and maybe 1 late round back up safety (either Jordan Sterns, Orion Smith, or Xavier Woods). It would be great if they could also pick up DT Nazair Jones as well, as one of their two 4th round picks. So that's 6 or 7 defensive players--& not all would be expected to be start right away. I think that's possible--if they trade for an extra pick or two--without sacrificing too much on offense in the draft (which they've already focused on in free agency, presumably because they're planning to draft heavily on defense).

Edited by MrSimpson
correction

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1Wrangler writes, "@Mr. Simpson, I haven't read anything yet on the Eagles possibly trading back in the first round. I have read that they could possibly trade back in the second round."

Trading back in the second would be a mistake, IMO. First, they won't get as much in return as they would by trading back in the 1st round (& yet would still be able to get an elite CB prospect later in the 1st round). And secondly, there are many promising players projected to go in the 2nd & 3rd round of this year's draft--so the more picks the Eagles can get in the 2nd (& 3rd), the better for their future. Every NFL team *knows* there's a glut of super promising cornerbacks (& safeties) in this year's draft, so I expect the very best prospects will be *heavily* taken off the board in the first 2-3 rounds. Which means the Eagles can't afford to sit back & wait like they did in free agency (at cornerback). They'll have to be more aggressive. That's why I think it would be smart to trade for an extra 2nd round pick prior to the draft (by trading Kelce, since we presently have three centers), so that the Eagles would have the option to acquire a non-cornerback in the 2nd round--such as RB Joe Mixon (or DE Barnett or LB Foster or WR Davis in the 1st). In fact, I'd like to see them do everything they can to acquire *two* additional 2nd round picks this year (trade back in #1, trade Kelce, Kendricks, JMatt--whatever it takes), since that's where I see the heart of this draft. Acquiring two cornerbacks and two non-cornerbacks in the the first two rounds makes a lot of sense, if possible, since it's such an important draft year for this team's future, more so than usual.

GreenbleedinFL--Of course, you may be right that Mixon's "a head case", considering the violent nature of his past incident, but I was impressed by his December 2016 "apology" press conference. Apparently, the hundreds of hours of counseling that Mixon received (& sought out) has helped him to get his head straight, and I now see him as a once confused kid that has turned himself around. I expect this transformation will become more evident during Mixon's first year in the NFL. Don't forget, Mixon was only 18 years old when the incident occurred, and there's been nothing since. He also had a strong, close bond with his fellow teammates in college, where he had a terrific locker room & on field presence, & was a team leader. So I suspect you may be wrong about the negativity he might bring to the Eagles locker room. Nor do I see him as a head case on the field either--not like Agholor--since he's unquestionably a very good football player, arguably the most versatile RB in the draft.

senhorcook writes, "But Simpson, given your own words, how are the Eagles going to completely redo the defense "(CB, RB, DE, & LB (& possibly S & WR)" and compete this year? CB, DE, LB, and possibly S is the whole defense minus Fletcher Cox. That's needing a perfect draft for a team that drafted horribly in the Chipper years."

Fortunately, the Chipper won't be drafting for us, so there's hope. ;-) No, I don't think they have to "completely redo the defense"--at least, not the starting line up, for the most part, except at the cornerback position. Which can be done. The Falcons had several rookies starting in their secondary last year, and they were certainly competitive. In my view, on defense, the Eagles need to draft 1 LB (or 2 if they trade Kendricks) (either Foster, T.J. Watt, Demarcus Walker, Jaylen-Reeves Maybin), 1 DE (Derek Barnett, Demarcus Walker, Jordan Willis, or the guy from Villanova), 3 CBs (Humphrey, & either K. King, Awuzie, Jackson, Moreau, Tankersley or Lewis, & Lampkin), and maybe 1 late round back up safety (either Jordan Sterns, Orion Smith, or Xavier Woods). It would be great if they could also pick up DT Nazair Jones as well, as one of their two 4th round picks. So that's 6 or 7 defensive players--& not all would be expected to be start right away. I think that's possible--if they trade for an extra pick or two--without sacrificing too much on offense in the draft (which they've already focused on in free agency, presumably because they're planning to draft heavily on defense).

Just saying he needs further vetting.We cannot afford to take him fairly high only to find out he's not gonna work here

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1Wrangler writes, "@Mr. Simpson, I haven't read anything yet on the Eagles possibly trading back in the first round. I have read that they could possibly trade back in the second round."

Trading back in the second would be a mistake, IMO. First, they won't get as much in return as they would by trading back in the 1st round (& yet would still be able to get an elite CB prospect later in the 1st round). And secondly, there are many promising players projected to go in the 2nd & 3rd round of this year's draft--so the more picks the Eagles can get in the 2nd (& 3rd), the better for their future. Every NFL team *knows* there's a glut of super promising cornerbacks (& safeties) in this year's draft, so I expect the very best prospects will be *heavily* taken off the board in the first 2-3 rounds. Which means the Eagles can't afford to sit back & wait like they did in free agency (at cornerback). They'll have to be more aggressive. That's why I think it would be smart to trade for an extra 2nd round pick prior to the draft (by trading Kelce, since we presently have three centers), so that the Eagles would have the option to acquire a non-cornerback in the 2nd round--such as RB Joe Mixon (or DE Barnett or LB Foster or WR Davis in the 1st). In fact, I'd like to see them do everything they can to acquire *two* additional 2nd round picks this year (trade back in #1, trade Kelce, Kendricks, JMatt--whatever it takes), since that's where I see the heart of this draft. Acquiring two cornerbacks and two non-cornerbacks in the the first two rounds makes a lot of sense, if possible, since it's such an important draft year for this team's future, more so than usual.

GreenbleedinFL--Of course, you may be right that Mixon's "a head case", considering the violent nature of his past incident, but I was impressed by his December 2016 "apology" press conference. Apparently, the hundreds of hours of counseling that Mixon received (& sought out) has helped him to get his head straight, and I now see him as a once confused kid that has turned himself around. I expect this transformation will become more evident during Mixon's first year in the NFL. Don't forget, Mixon was only 18 years old when the incident occurred, and there's been nothing since. He also had a strong, close bond with his fellow teammates in college, where he had a terrific locker room & on field presence, & was a team leader. So I suspect you may be wrong about the negativity he might bring to the Eagles locker room. Nor do I see him as a head case on the field either--not like Agholor--since he's unquestionably a very good football player, arguably the most versatile RB in the draft.

senhorcook writes, "But Simpson, given your own words, how are the Eagles going to completely redo the defense "(CB, RB, DE, & LB (& possibly S & WR)" and compete this year? CB, DE, LB, and possibly S is the whole defense minus Fletcher Cox. That's needing a perfect draft for a team that drafted horribly in the Chipper years."

Fortunately, the Chipper won't be drafting for us, so there's hope. ;-) No, I don't think they have to "completely redo the defense"--at least, not the starting line up, for the most part, except at the cornerback position. Which can be done. The Falcons had several rookies starting in their secondary last year, and they were certainly competitive. In my view, on defense, the Eagles need to draft 1 LB (or 2 if they trade Kendricks) (either Foster, T.J. Watt, Demarcus Walker, Jaylen-Reeves Maybin), 1 DE (Derek Barnett, Demarcus Walker, Jordan Willis, or the guy from Villanova), 3 CBs (Humphrey, & either K. King, Awuzie, Jackson, Moreau, Tankersley or Lewis, & Lampkin), and maybe 1 late round back up safety (either Jordan Sterns, Orion Smith, or Xavier Woods). It would be great if they could also pick up DT Nazair Jones as well, as one of their two 4th round picks. So that's 6 or 7 defensive players--& not all would be expected to be start right away. I think that's possible--if they trade for an extra pick or two--without sacrificing too much on offense in the draft (which they've already focused on in free agency, presumably because they're planning to draft heavily on defense).

IMO this CB draft is so deep usable CB's can be had much later.As I have said find a guy that FITS,not the guy that's highest ranked because of his college stats alone.Guy like Awuzie,Shaquille Griffin and UDFA Lapkin would be great pick-ups to add to out TOP starter(which could easily be had n round 2.Still see no reason to waste a 1 pick on a CB

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

"Still see no reason to waste a 1 pick on a CB"

You may be right, but it depends entirely on who's still on the board at 14.  However, Awuzie is projected to go before Humphrey in some mocks--in the teens of the first round.  I don't know Patrick Robinson.  Maybe he's a starter?   But otherwise, I don't think they have *anyone* at CB (unless some of these CBs that didn't play last year turn out to be better than expected in 2017).  And if the Eagles don't both fix the problem in a big way *and* add more depth to the position, as I see it, the whole season will be badly effected. 

As for Mixon, he's lived and learned from his mistake, something we're all supposed to do.  & he's genuinely & sincerely asked for forgiveness (of the woman he hurt, of his teammates, his mother, his family, etc.).  So, I think he's made tremendous progress.  I can't say the same about Dalvin Cook, who right now I see as a bigger risk than Mixon. 

Edited by MrSimpson
added a phrase, corrected name
1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dion Jordan is far from the only bust from his 2013 draft class. For whatever reason, the top half(-ish) of the first round that year is riddled with disappointments: only four of the top 12 players taken are still with the team that drafted them, and seven of the top 17.

The draft is always hit-or-miss, but there’s generally a higher percentage of teams that at least get the first round right, and most of the teams picking 18-32 in the first round chose wisely.

Here’s the top 17 picks from 2013, and where they are now. The names in bold are the players still with the team that drafted them:

1.OT Eric Fisher, Kansas City Chiefs
2. OT Luke Joeckel, Jacksonville Jaguars: Spent much of 2016 on injured reserve; signed one-year contract with Seattle this month
3. DE Dion Jordan, Miami Dolphins: Played just 26 games over first two seasons before suspensions derailed career
4. OT Lane Johnson, Philadelphia Eagles
5. DE Ziggy Ansah, Detroit Lions
6. LB Barkevious Mingo, Cleveland Browns: Traded to New England during training camp last year, signed free-agent deal with Indianapolis this month
7. OG Jonathan Cooper, Arizona Cardinals: Traded to New England in March 2016, released in October, signed with Dallas this month
8. WR Tavon Austin, St. Louis/Los Angeles Rams
9. CB Dee Milliner, New York Jets: Waived/injured last September, remains a free agent
10. OG Chance Warmack, Tennessee Titans: Spent much of 2016 on injured reserve; signed one-year deal with the Eagles this month
11. OT D.J. Fluker, San Diego Chargers: Moved from right tackle to right guard before 2015 season; released by Chargers this month and signed with Giants
12. CB D.J. Hayden, Oakland Raiders: Ended last season on injured reserve; signed one-year contract with Detroit this month
13. DT Sheldon Richardson, New York Jets
14. DT Star Lotulelei, Carolina Panthers
15. S Kenny Vaccaro, New Orleans Saints
16. QB E.J. Manuel, Buffalo Bills: Went 6-11 in 17 starts (29 appearances), losing job to Tyrod Taylor in 2015; signed with the Raiders this month
17. LB Jarvis Jones, Pittsburgh Steelers: Played in 50 games (35 starts) with the Steelers; signed with the Cardinals this month
See? It’s not pretty. And there’s only two Pro Bowl appearances between the seven players that have been able to stick with the team that drafted them, with one each for Ansah and Richardson (who was named AP defensive rookie of the year for 2013).

I can remember a lot of Eagles fans wanted CB Dee Milliner or DE Dion Jordan with our first pick in 2013. Lets hope that Joe Douglas gets it right.

4 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

IMO, this is a much stronger draft year than 2013--& particularly where the Eagles most need help.

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Two other players come to mind that were fan favorites prior to other drafts and the fans had them judged correctly. In 2010 a lot of fans wanted Earl Thomas with our 13th pick. The Eagles selected Graham at pick 13 and the Seahawks took Thomas with the 14th pick. In 2012 the fan favorite by a lot of Eagles fans was Luke Kuechly. He was selected by the Panthers with pick #9 and the Eagles took Fletcher Cox with pick #12.

In an earlier comment when I was debating about the possibility of taking a RB in the first round, DC reminded me that the Eagles haven't drafted a RB in the first round since 1986. It got me thinking about other positional players we need in the draft so I looked up a couple other different positions. Since 1936, the Eagles have only drafted 1 CB in the first round. That would be Lito Sheperd with the 26th pick in 2002. I also was surprised to learn that since 1936 the Eagles have only drafted 5 WR's in the first round. They are

1982 Mike Quick pick #26
1984 Kenny Jackson pick #4
2001 Freddie Mitchell pick #25
2009 Jeremy Maclin pick #19
2015 Nelson Agholor pick # 20.

You can take this info for what its worth however I think the odds are against the Eagles taking a CB in round one. I'll let it up to you to determine their success rate when they take a WR in round 1.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Two other players come to mind that were fan favorites prior to other drafts and the fans had them judged correctly. In 2010 a lot of fans wanted Earl Thomas with our 13th pick. The Eagles selected Graham at pick 13 and the Seahawks took Thomas with the 14th pick. In 2012 the fan favorite by a lot of Eagles fans was Luke Kuechly. He was selected by the Panthers with pick #9 and the Eagles took Fletcher Cox with pick #12.

In an earlier comment when I was debating about the possibility of taking a RB in the first round, DC reminded me that the Eagles haven't drafted a RB in the first round since 1986. It got me thinking about other positional players we need in the draft so I looked up a couple other different positions. Since 1936, the Eagles have only drafted 1 CB in the first round. That would be Lito Sheperd with the 26th pick in 2002. I also was surprised to learn that since 1936 the Eagles have only drafted 5 WR's in the first round. They are

1982 Mike Quick pick #26
1984 Kenny Jackson pick #4
2001 Freddie Mitchell pick #25
2009 Jeremy Maclin pick #19
2015 Nelson Agholor pick # 20.

You can take this info for what its worth however I think the odds are against the Eagles taking a CB in round one. I'll let it up to you to determine their success rate when they take a WR in round 1.

Hold the press! I made a mistake. The Eagles have taken two CB's in the first round since 1936. The one I missed was Roynell Young in 1980 selected with pick #23 that year.

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey G-Freak y'all hear anything abou Trips D, is he still with us...DDD or jwood...always argued for a full-back on this team. There is that C.R.S issue again, daaag I am only 59. Brizer was quite the scholarly eccentric, " for the bored." Hahaha....what about FLF...she would get soooo fired up about grammar and paragraphs,  Much respect to the OG's like yourself mjkline 1958, Stine and Joemas, c ham the man,Thomas Jackson. Sorry, so many other names I should/ could add...y'all have kept this site to a very high standard... I appreciate the distraction and knowledge... I may not always agree with some points of view posted here... but that the point, exchanging ideas, creating an atmosphere that Fanatics can express their points of views. RESPECT.

3 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Two other players come to mind that were fan favorites prior to other drafts and the fans had them judged correctly. In 2010 a lot of fans wanted Earl Thomas with our 13th pick. The Eagles selected Graham at pick 13 and the Seahawks took Thomas with the 14th pick. In 2012 the fan favorite by a lot of Eagles fans was Luke Kuechly. He was selected by the Panthers with pick #9 and the Eagles took Fletcher Cox with pick #12.

In an earlier comment when I was debating about the possibility of taking a RB in the first round, DC reminded me that the Eagles haven't drafted a RB in the first round since 1986. It got me thinking about other positional players we need in the draft so I looked up a couple other different positions. Since 1936, the Eagles have only drafted 1 CB in the first round. That would be Lito Sheperd with the 26th pick in 2002. I also was surprised to learn that since 1936 the Eagles have only drafted 5 WR's in the first round. They are

1982 Mike Quick pick #26
1984 Kenny Jackson pick #4
2001 Freddie Mitchell pick #25
2009 Jeremy Maclin pick #19
2015 Nelson Agholor pick # 20.

You can take this info for what its worth however I think the odds are against the Eagles taking a CB in round one. I'll let it up to you to determine their success rate when they take a WR in round 1.

Well like I said then if both Davis and Williams are gone,that may leave Howard,although I also like Hodges with a later pick-so who knows what the FO is thinking

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A move I wished the Eagles would have done by now. Band-aid, sometimes they're needed.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/04/02/adrian-peterson-to-visit-the-patriots/

Dunno,maybe he has some time left,but he's getting old,older players are more prone to injury although with the RB stable in NE,they could rest him some.let's see Gronk/AP/Brandon Cooks.Yep Bellicheat knows his stuff

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/31/2017 at 9:09 PM, cunninghamtheman said:

Not a bad list BG of your 11 or 12 guys. Fairly comparable to Wranglers thinking if I recall his 11 list. I'm assuming,that you're assuming, Myles Garrett is already gone(making the 12). You left out RB and T. Did you not feel one was good enough? Or what was your thinking on them.

Yea Garrett would be on the list a no brainier pick but he should be the 1st overall pick 

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As for T yea I don't see any worth taking and RB only guy I would possibly consider at 14 would be Fournette who should be gone.....

3 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Peterson is unlikely to get 17 million per ever again... The rich get richer, that winning Patriot culture will be very attractive to an old RB who even without a SB ring is probably still Hall of fame bound. Peterson is a band-aid I would sign.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was checking out Brian Hill(RB).pretty inconsistent-I'd pass

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As for T yea I don't see any worth taking and RB only guy I would possibly consider at 14 would be Fournette who should be gone.....

Why?? we need dept/h youth at T(both OT and DT)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, GreenbleedinFL said:

Why?? we need dept/h youth at T(both OT and DT)

I asnwered Cunninghams questions of why I didn't have an OT listed in my top 11-12 guys.....I don't think any OT is worth taking in round 1 damn sure not at #14 but that is JMO 

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would of thought that Blount would have been a consideration... We have not had great luck with Ex Patriots, they sign here, on their way back to the Patsy's... that Safety we had here played like Crap for us, went back to New England and made Pro-Bowls. I just can't think of his name... not a player I want to remember... I suspect these old RB want to be paid for quite possibly their last contract.

2 people like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0