DaveSpadaro

[News] On An Unusual Schedule, News And Notes

362 posts in this topic

is it just me or has this place changed... the layout is different... mrrr.

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3 minutes ago, mjkline1958 said:

Hey FLF, long time. How's life across the pond?

we're all bonkers is what we are. i can't wait for this blasted election to be over.

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Be careful what you wish for FLF, look what we wound up with

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4 minutes ago, mjkline1958 said:

Be careful what you wish for FLF, look what we wound up with

we might be the only country in the world where 2 candidates are indicted for theft fraud embezzlement etc.. i was always rather proud that we were a laidback country, but this takes the cake !! :roll:

 

anyway. hope everybody is ready for the draft. i stayed up late last thursday, and was a few hours into realizing i had the wrong thursday. bonkers i tell you !!

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Well, you caught the schedule release. Most of us think the draft should be about 2 weeks sooner, drives us nuts.

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mateagle2 writes, "Lattimore is the only one worth the value at 14"

One thing that I think people are forgetting about in relation to this CB group is that a good number of the prospects are very young--only about 20 years old. That's one of the reasons why it's such a big group this year--with 12 CBs expected to go in the top 75. So when the critics suggest that Marlon Humphrey, for example, is a great, hard hitting tackler, but may be lacking in other areas, they're talking about a very good 20 year old athlete that will undoubtedly continue to develop and improve! Sidney Jones is also only 20 years old, etc.

So the Eagles have to now decide whether they're going to focus on acquiring two of the most 'ready to start' CBs--i.e., the most complete players in the draft, or whether they're willing to be more patient and add two or three of the most talented, promising ones--such as Adoree Jackson, for example, and be willing to throw those players to the wolves as they did with Jalen Mills last year, knowing that it will be a learning experience and won't always look pretty. Those are two different draft scenarios, as I see it--though I suppose the Eagles could opt for a combination of the two.

The first strategy means that the Eagles will take the best CB on the board at #14--whether that's Lattimore or Conley, and also use their high 2nd round pick to take another of the most 'ready to start' CBs on the board (such as maybe Kevin King, who's impressive).  Given that the Eagles have more or less traded away their early 3rd round pick (for Timmy Jernigan), that would mean the early rounds of this year's draft would be exclusively about CBs. Which makes sense, since the Eagles have *no* starters at CB heading into 2017.

However, I don't think that's the best way to go with this draft, since it is such a strong draft year--not only at CB, but also at other positions where the Eagles most need help, such as at RB, LB, & DE. Besides, it's not that easy to say who's going to work out as a top starter in the NFL and who isn't, especially with the unusual amount of depth at CB this year. Granted, Lattimore looks to be the most complete player--right now, but he's had some injury issues, and I'm not sure I'd be willing to bet the house that Lattimore is going to turn out to be the best of the group. He may do so, but a number of the other top CB prospects could turn out to be a better in the NFL. Even though I agree, right now, they all seem to have their strengths and weaknesses (often due to their youth). Conley, for example, is great in coverage, but still needs to learn to tackle better. etc. Only time will tell.

So, unless the Eagles strongly believe that Lattimore & Conley are *the* standout CBs of this year's draft, and I mean unquestionably so, I think they'd be wiser to trade back and pick up an extra 2nd round pick. Especially with this year's outstanding group of CBs, as there will almost certainly be several top prospects left on the board in the low to mid 20s--such as Kevin King, Chidobe Awuzie, Marlon Humphrey, Fabian Moreau, etc. Nor should getting an additional 2nd round pick in this year's strong draft be underestimated either--particularly for a team that has as many important gaps to fill as the Eagles do.

Of course, they could use all three top picks on CBs, and say take the injured Sidney Jones in the 2nd round as well. But I'm not sure that's their best move either, since the Eagles also need to find a #1 RB, another starting LB, and arguably an edge rusher too.

Nor am I convinced that the underrated Ashton Lampkin isn't *as ready to start* in the NFL as some of the other more' highly rated' CB prospects in this draft. He's very fast and quick (which shows in his films, and he proved it again at the Combine), has excellent ball skills, and is very tenacious. And, as I've said before but it bears repeating--Lampkin had no problem covering WR Laquon Treadwell in his *junior* year (& actually had an interception against Treadwell), unlike Tre'davius White, who failed miserably to do so. I think that speaks volumes about Lampkin's readiness for the NFL.

And therefore, if the Eagles can pick up a CB in the 20s, and another one in the 2nd round--i.e., two top CB prospects for the price of one! (for their #14 pick), and *be sure* to additionally draft Lampkin in the mid to late rounds, that would give them three very promising CB prospects heading into 2017. And!!!, they'd still get another 2nd round pick on top of that--to either draft RB Joe Mixon, LB T.J. Watt, CB Sidney Jones, or maybe even WR Corey Davis (who may go later than expected due to post-surgery complications?). So yeah, I'd take a 1st and 2nd round pick next week for Sam Bradford.

Edited by MrSimpson
correction
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7 hours ago, downwithdallas said:

I don't know why people think Howie is in trouble or can't draft look at his draft history. MS2 was obviously a Chip pick he controlled everything when he was here look at those drafts full of his old players and players he played against. I know Howie took responsibility for the pick but that's his job as GM.

I would take Conley over Lattimore any day. Lattimore is injury prone and a 1 year wonder where as Conley is not either of them. Lattimore gets boosted because of his height weight and speed we have seen that back fire many times in the past.

Can't agree about MS2. Seems pretty clear he was Howie's pick. That's why Chipper wasn't going to let him near the field. He was what Chip used to wrestle control away from Rosie.

  Lattimore has issues. He doesn't want to get involved in run support. Durability questions. And he doesn't play on film up to that combine time.

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8 hours ago, BleedingGreen93 said:

Lets be fair to Graham he was having a promising rookie year till injury injury really set him back.....Then on top of that injury got buried be coaching changes/scheme changes 

Graham proved that he was held back and ready for a bigger role sooner once we saw how he flourished as the starter. That's what I worry about at times. That an MS2 isn't getting enough opportunity because of a Barwin. Or that a Grymes isn't getting to the next level because we are forcing a McKelvin as that vet starter.

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If Fournette by some ridiculous scenario falls outside the top 10...I would trade up for him.

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cunninghamtheman writes, "Graham proved that he was held back and ready for a bigger role sooner once we saw how he flourished as the starter. That's what I worry about at times. That an MS2 isn't getting enough opportunity because of a Barwin. Or that a Grymes isn't getting to the next level because we are forcing a McKelvin as that vet starter."

Those thoughts have crossed my mind too. Each of the past couple of years there have been players that stood out in the Eagles pre-season, only to be put on the practice squad or cut, so that certain "high salary" picks or vets could play (poorly) instead. In the past two years I've actually felt that the Eagles regular season team wasn't as *talented* as the promise the team showed in the pre-season. For example, Steven Means stood out in the pre-season last year, but didn't play much, except for special teams, where he excelled. Barwin played instead, and was only average. The same was true with MS2, who looked like he took to Schwartz's scheme extremely well in the pre-season, & yet Smith was given little opportunity to prove himself in the regular season. So, I can't help but ask myself, do the Eagles really need to spend a high draft pick on yet another edge rusher this coming week? When between Means, Long, Curry, Smith2, and McCallister, surely they can find two very good starters? And particularly so, considering this team has so many other important needs to fill--especially in the defensive backfield, which played so poorly last year that *no one* should be surprised to see the Eagles take 4 DBs!! in this year's draft, in order to be certain they can solve the problem. (Because right now, the 2017 season would probably be lost if Jenkins got injured.)

CB Aaron Grymes similarly stood out in the pre-season, and yet was cut--so that McKelvin and Carroll could play poorly instead. C.J. Smith likewise showed that he had some real athletic ability in the pre-season, & yet he spent the majority of the season on the practice squad. (I believe Smith played only one snap in 2016!) CB JaCorey Shepherd also probably wasn't given enough of a chance. And of course, WR Paul Turner proved again and again that he was the most sure-handed receiver on the team, and could get open, and yet the coaches chose instead to play our three regular "night-clubbers"--Green-Beckham, Agholor, and Treggs--who dropped balls, couldn't get open, and were among the least productive receivers in the NFL. Indeed the Eagles had done the same the year before when they let WR Rasheed Bailey go--who was impressive in the pre-season--only to start a terrible group of WRs.

Not to mention the gigantic blunder!!! of trading CB Eric Rowe at the opening of 2016, in favor of starting CBs that got burned repeatedly throughout the season and essentially cost us a winning season, and were one of the primary reasons why the Eagles didn't make the playoffs.

I've said it before, but it sure looks like this organization repeatedly has trouble recognizing who their best players are. Which doesn't give me a whole lot of confidence heading into this year's draft. Yet, as always, I remain hopeful.
 

Edited by MrSimpson
Edited, correction
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On 4/21/2017 at 7:14 PM, ASG15 said:

It seems to me this downward slide started when JJ died. He covered up a lot of mistakes.

You are talking about 2008 to 2009.   lets look.   No Dawkins, no Thomas, no Runyan ... Westbrook got hurt ... The Andrews bros fiasco ... losing the stability at QB.  The leadership in general fizzled.   Players mentioned above, plus guys like Sheldon Brown, no more Trotter.   You had the bronze medal group that I like to call them... the speed guys, but not the mentality of the previous or original Andy Reid era as far as leadership and toughness.   In addition to losing JJ, our best football strategist of the last 20 years ... we lost all that from the player perspective.  

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