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DaveSpadaro

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>>>>joemas: you love the Sproles signing & trade. I am OK with it. He cost a late round pick. You see a big role for him. Me, not so much. Not seeing Sproles as RB

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Exactly Woody... because you listen to the radio. I watch games. You see a bigger role for Sproles in the return game than me.

I see Shady as a starter and playing the majority of snaps. I like him running it about 19 times per game. like last year. I want him off the field in situations where he probably won't get the ball. It's a waste of energy for him. Remember the old school days of a 3rd down back giving the starter rest? Maybe more 1980s than 70s? That is the compliment that Sproles brings. He played 31% of the Saints offensive snaps while missing one game. I expect the same, he doesn't take shots, he is a solid 190 lbs for 5'6". Add 5 lbs per inch and you have a 6 foot 220lb guy.

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No Mas you have to be careful with the fact that N.O. had him play 31% of snaps. The Saints passed the ball at an incredible percentage like 66% if memory serves me. Passing the ball that much dictates having a pass catching back in. Also adds to having him in the slot. Chip's O his first season was pretty much the opposite.

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http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/player/_/stat/rushing/sort/rushingAttempts/qualified/false/count/41

Bryce Brown ranked 61st in rushing attempts with 75

Darren Sproles ranked 77th with 53

Sproles played one less game for a team that like to pass. What would you imagine his role to be within our "RUNNING" offense, and how can anyone with a logical mind not see how this replaces Brown's role as the #2 RB with

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http://espn.go.com/nfl/team/stats/_/name/no/new-orleans-saints

Comparing the Saints and the Eagles 2013 regular season stats... RB rush attempts.

Sproles had 53 of the teams 347 rushing attempts from RBs. Keep in mind he had the 4th most attempts out of their RBs and their FB carried it 15 times. 15.27 % of the team's attempts splitting it 5 ways.

Brown had 75 out of 400 attempts from Eagles RBs. We only had 3 RBs with carries and Polk had 11. Which is 4 less than the Saints FB Jed Collins... their 5th leading rusher. 18.75% of the team's attempts splitting it 3 ways!

Now agreeing with Ham, that Sproles was out there on passing downs and that's why he caught a lot of balls. Logic tells me he should get more rushing attempts, but less receptions than he did with the Saints. The 24 more attempts that Bryce had than Sproles is only 1.5 carries per game. I Sproles adds those 24 carries and subtracts 24 receptions and goes from 71 to 47. It's still 3 catches per game as a backup RB to Shady. That's enough of a role to be the #2. Polk should be able to carry the load of 11 carries again ..LOL. Now add the possibility of Tucker or another addition via draft or UDFA... where does that leave Bryce. I'm not even making the talent argument yet... lets say I agree he is this phenom, my question is when does he play?

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If you look through that list you posted you will notice that Sproles was the fourth option for rushing attempts on the Saints. Do you feel the Saints have stronger rbs than the Eags? Obviously not counting Shady.

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Ham, who cares... touches... Sproles had 71 catches & 53 Rush attempts. 124 in 15 games... compare that to Brown? I don't think he had 90 touches. My point is that he fills the role and more of what Bryce did last year. If you want to see Polk develop further as the #3 (who also plays ST unlike Brown) Where is the role for Brown? Enough to be concerned if they trade him for a 5th round pick?

If they paid Sproles that 3 year contract and traded a 5th round pick for him ... can we assume they actually plan to use him for at least the amount of touches (less than 6 per game) that Bryce Brown had last year?

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First I don't think Bryce had a good season last year. That lead to less touches and a higher dependency on Shady. Not what anyone is really looking for either way. Now I have no problem with trading Brown unlike Wood. Sproles touches wise will be the number 2 back unless a RB comes early in the draft. I see Sproles as a great weapon on those bubble screens which is not unlike being a return man. I also see him utilized in the slot. His receiving is his big weapon. He rushed the ball fairly effectively because teams play him for the pass. The spacing O that Chip uses should only benefit this. Now if something happened to the number one back I only see Sproles adding a couple touches. Pretty much his role wouldn't change much. That's where you come to the next RB/rbs. Like I said touches wise Sproles will be number 2 back. But in case of injury the number two rushing back should be someone else taking over as number one. The goal isn't duplicating Brown's poor season last year. The answer could be Brown, Polk, Tucker or new guy. But in a traditional sense Sproles isn't a number two back. He's a third down back/slot wr/returner.

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Whats all the talk about Spoles, Brown n Polk again? lol 1. Shady 2. Sproles 3. Brown/Polk.. If Shady misses a game it will be Brown or Polk starting.. Sproles will stay as 2.. My question is who would you rather have start out of Brown n Polk? Think both players need to get into a groove to get going.. Guessing alot of players do though

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Ham, here is how I would rank the Saints & Eagles RBs.... Shady ahead by a mile. The other guys you could argue, but they are close enough. I like the functionality of the Saints RBs and how they play specific situations. I like how the Saints RBs fit together. Polk & Brown are vanilla to me. Nothing special on short yardage, 3rd downs ..etc. There was no time during the season I wanted Shady off the field for one of them.

I don't see this great talent in Bryce Brown? Talent for RB = speed, quickness, maneuverability and power. I only see speed from Brown. He's not quick to a spot, can't juke a guy and can't run a guy over. He can run around the end, and functions when the blocking is there, just like any other NFL RB should. Go watch his highlights, and tell me anything other than an outside or off tackle run to where he gets good blocking. Any RB can run through a big hole, the good ones find them more often or can get yardage on their own enough of the time. Nothing special enough to me if we lose him... same with Brandon Graham. I don't care if they could be good players on other teams if they don't fit on mine.

So are we just keeping Brown around incase Shady gets injured?

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The talk with trading a talent like Brown coz he might not contribute on ST like Polk is i dunno get blown up for no reason?? When it comes to depth you want to be talent deep.. To have the confidence in that talent to play, start or contribute when their number is called.. Look at the WR situation as of now.. Maclin n Cooper then?? Got like 10 WRs but who would the team or you as a fan be confident in starting? They may all play ST but if Maclin goes down good chance someone gets cut to make room for someone who can possibly contribute more.. Tucker for example when he was brought up n was it Poyer that was cut.. My point is be good at playing primary position n being able to play ST is a plus

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Polk and Brown are young. It's early to classify them as vanilla. They are just starting to tap into their potential. Maybe they have it. Maybe they don't. The key your looking for that you left off is vision for a RB(well you basically were saying it). Brandon Graham to me is a whole other animal. The Eags paid a high price in the draft and time to see him come through. It was awkward at first transitioning to the 3-4. But he adjusted and began to look the part at years end. I want to see what he has in his contract year. After everything this could be the year it finally pays off. He hasn't done enough for me to be sold on him. But on the other hand a second year as LB and he has the potential to be the teams number one pass rusher. Maybe I'm dreaming but I felt like his last year in the wide nine he was just that one step away from closing the deal. I feel like this will be his best season to date. I'd like competition. You need 4 OLBs. Have to get a better option than Casey Matthews. Playing three OLBs consistently will happen in this D. A fourth could easily be worked in some. All without considering injury.

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DDD here's my version 2.0

WR Kelvin Benjamin

WR Brandon Cooks

WR Jordan Matthews

SS Deone Bucannon

SS Jimmy Ward

LB Trent Murphy

LB Carl Bradford

CB Bradley Roby

CB Keith McGill

DT Stephen Tuitt

Thanks!

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>>>joemas: perhaps Sean Payton out coached Chip Kelly? I think it starts right there. Saints an indoor team and underdogs at Linc. Like I said before, Chip has his own learning curve.

Saints OL dominated Eagles D. Ground game rolled. Brees not touched until Graham got him. Shady running in the spread was mostly neutralized.

Believe Eagles had talent to win that game. Payton's game plan--even with 2 turn overs beat Kelly's....

Say it again: lesson games for Chip--

New Orleans

Dallas

Denver

Minnesota

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>>>joemas: apples and oranges comparing Saints O with Sproles and Eagles O with Sproles. Saints are a pass first O with Brees and his weapons. Eagles are a run first O with Shady and his back-ups.

I think the question to be asked is: did the OL make Shady or did Shady make the OL? Of course a bit of both--and the OL had amazing stats-- but is that the real story?

Did I see too many runs where the RB could not follow his blocks and hit the hole? Watching Oregon play the Spread and Eagles play the Spread what sticks out is how Oregon RBs do not need to cutback. Watching Eagles, Shady's unique start / stop or cutback skill often makes a run out of thin air. Both Damaris Johnson and Darren Sproles have "waterbug" moves too. Personally I hate seeing my RB playing waterbug behind the LoS. To me-- it says the DL is winning the battle in the trenches. Just my prejudice and perspective: I saw too much water bugging in 2013!

The follow up by you is adding more waterbugs. Not me. I want the Spread Offense and OL that Lagarrette Blount and LaMichael James enjoyed. Run it hard down hill!!

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>>>PPW-- you, joemas and DDD are in such a hurry to trade away Bryce Brown!! Honestly, it amazes me. Bryce Browns don't grow on trees and he is ONLY 22 YEARS OLD. A baby RB. And, he runs 4.38 at 225lbs. Catches passes and blocks. Y'all have a loose screw someplace.

Woody, you have me confused with 93 on trading away brownie. I have never taken a position one way or another on him leaving the team. You shot 3D because you aimed last in your sequence of events.

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This really sucks. 3 months ago I planned a trip to Ireland in May because I knew the draft was always in April. Now I will be in a small town name Gort, Ireland during the draft. Good thing is I will be meeting someone who used to talk with me on this forum 4 years ago and lives in the UK... GJ Theo was his handle I think... Well I will have a guiness and watch it on my computer I guess....

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Woody .. .agreed. downhill running... and that's why I don't see Bryce as a fit... he isn't a downhill runner. It's not size to me, it's skill set. I'll take Walter Payton, Marcus Allen and Ricky Watters in my offense and in this offense. You have guys that can run down hill, outside, and can play goal line and passing situations. Sproles, believe it or not, isn't a dancer when he runs... he goes downhill very well and quickly. Not your waterbug ... of course if you actually watched him instead of just looking at his size and great receiving stats, you would notice this.

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>>>DDD: sorry about that hole in your britches, Pardner. Hope I did not hit anything valuable!!

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And AGAIN... I'm not in a hurry to trade Bryce. It just won't be the end of the world to me because I don't see him getting reps on our team and eventually he will walk. I doubt he sees 50 touches in an Eagles uniform over the next 2 seasons.

BG gives the reason, because he actually has trade value! you aren't going to get anything for Polk or Tucker.

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