nottingham14

Kirk Cousins is the next Brees

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21 minutes ago, nottingham14 said:

Paco are you illiterate? I believe so. He did not even mention arm strength one time in the excerpt you quoted that I saw. He spoke completely about taking chances downfield and specifically guys not being wide open but taking chances with the throw. He’s clearly talking about him being risk averse. If Jon Gruden wanted to say his arm was weak he would’ve said it. AS A MATTER OF FACT GRUDEN IS ENCOURAGING HIM TO THROW THEM! I’ve seen guy make the same point about guys big arm or not. Sometimes you got to let the WR make the play. But according to you he can’t throw certain routes, yet Gruden is encouraging him to throw them anyways. 

 

Speaking of ignoring facts. How about the FACT that you allege Cousins has a weak arm, but he registered the highest ball velocity of the QBs the year he came out? 

 

 

 

Go back to our exchange.  You are the one that brought up arm strength, not me.  You can't even keep your rants straight

On 3/15/2018 at 4:25 PM, paco said:

And even with Desean and Garcon to throw to he still couldnt get double digit wins.  Hell, he didn't beat a team with a winning record the year they went 9-7 and "won" the division.

 

Hes average.  He knows he's average.  He even told Gruden there are routes he won't throw because he's likely to get picked off (that's why his INT rate dropped dramatically)

 

On 3/15/2018 at 4:37 PM, nottingham14 said:

So his INT rate dropped because he wont throw certain routes? :roll: 

You crack me up. You act like he has the arm strength of a 5 year old. Like I said before, he had the same arm strength as many guys who have succeeded. He is at very least a poor man's Drew Brees. Which makes him well worth the money he is paid, considering how good Brees is. Now he is going to a dome, where half his games will be played without wind conditions. That is exactly what Brees did, like I pointed out earlier. He will also play in a dome in DET too. That's 9 guaranteed dome games a season. 

Diggs and Thelien are looking like stellar WRs. I think Diggs is a real star if given the chance, but AT is also pretty talented and out shined Diggs last season. That's a good group to have, with Cook in the backfield who can catch too, if healthy. The team he chose shows how smart the guy is TBH. Of the teams out there after him, he chose the best possible spot for him. 

 

 

Ironically, in your latest rant you confirmed EXACTLY what I was saying in that post I made last year.  But nice straw man you built there claiming I was talking about arm strength, when in fact it was you,  to try to be "right".

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8 hours ago, paco said:

Well lets catch you up then....

You claimed a knock on Foles coming out of college is that he had a weak arm, but we pulled up scouting reports to the contrary.  Care to address?

When I stated that Kirk told Gruden he would not throw certain routes because he can't make all the throws, you called me a liar.  I pulled up quotes of him AND Gruden discussing this.  Care to address?

Foles arm strength:

"If we were to take a step back, and suss out a more general takeaway from Nick Foles’ success under Chip Kelly and now again under Doug Pederson, it would be this: he can quickly make your defenders wrong. Arm strength and ball velocity are not strengths of Foles’, but processing speed and pre-snap recognition are.”

https://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2019/1/3/18165047/nick-foles-philadelphia-eagles-doug-pederson-chip-kelly

 

https://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2012/12/18/3778840/raanan-review-nick-foles-arm-strength

 

 

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14 minutes ago, paco said:

Go back to our exchange.  You are the one that brought up arm strength, not me.  You can't even keep your rants straight

 

 

 

Ironically, in your latest rant you confirmed EXACTLY what I was saying in that post I made last year.  But nice straw man you built there claiming I was talking about arm strength, when in fact it was you,  to try to be "right".

You are so illiterate you can’t even read your own posts. 

"When I stated that Kirk told Gruden he would not throw certain routes because he CAN’T make all the throws, you called me a liar.”-Illiterate Paco

 

If you are saying CANT MAKE THROWS, that’s arm strength. You clearly restated your own argument that he CANT make throws, so he doesn’t. The article you posted said NOTHING about can’t make throws. It said doesn’t. It said he won’t give the WR a chance to make the play. The article even had Gruden saying he should throw passes you allege he CANT THROW. You’re so illiterate you CANT make the distinction between your argument and the source you use to prove your point. 

Sad a grown man doesn’t know the difference between can’t and won’t. 

 

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24 minutes ago, paco said:

Go back to our exchange.  You are the one that brought up arm strength, not me.  You can't even keep your rants straight

 

 

 

Ironically, in your latest rant you confirmed EXACTLY what I was saying in that post I made last year.  But nice straw man you built there claiming I was talking about arm strength, when in fact it was you,  to try to be "right".

Also another education in distinction.....

Cousins, nor Gruden named any specific routes he wouldn’t throw, as you assert. What Gruden is clearly identifying to anyone with any sense, is Cousins will only throw routes where guys are open and not take risks. I never saw him say Cousins won’t throw a Go Route because he CANT. Or that he CANT throw a 15 yard out. He said he can’t scheme so every pass he throws is to a wide open WR.

When you say routes you are talking specific routes by name, curl, go, slant and so on. When he says routes he’s meaning in general all the routes in a game, some are open and some are not, so Cousins won’t throw to guys not open, being risk averse.

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36 minutes ago, gameshowfan91 said:

Cousins not able to close a game against Brees and Saints after being up by 15: 

 

And game losing moments like this:

 

Sucking in Playoff game against Packers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YLK95Qxcco

In which he choked last season (while Foles didn't): 

Another video on that game: 

 

Yes. It was on first & Goal.

Cousins has done that many times in his career and cost his team. Only "big game" he won was against Eagles who had quit on Chip Kelly. He's not as good as you think he is.

And Peyton Manning couldn’t win big games until he did. People always have ignorant points of view until someone gives them a big can of STFU.

I seem to remember a time when people, MYSELF INCLUDED, thought Brees sucked too when he was in SD. Then he started racking up historic seasons mid career.

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1 hour ago, nottingham14 said:

And Peyton Manning couldn’t win big games until he did. People always have ignorant points of view until someone gives them a big can of STFU.

I seem to remember a time when people, MYSELF INCLUDED, thought Brees sucked too when he was in SD. Then he started racking up historic seasons mid career.

Peyton Manning and Drew Brees are FAR better than Kirk Cousins. They are Hall of Famers while Cousins even struggles to get his team to Playoffs.

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3 hours ago, nottingham14 said:

You are so illiterate you can’t even read your own posts. 

"When I stated that Kirk told Gruden he would not throw certain routes because he CAN’T make all the throws, you called me a liar.”-Illiterate Paco

 

If you are saying CANT MAKE THROWS, that’s arm strength. You clearly restated your own argument that he CANT make throws, so he doesn’t. The article you posted said NOTHING about can’t make throws. It said doesn’t. It said he won’t give the WR a chance to make the play. The article even had Gruden saying he should throw passes you allege he CANT THROW. You’re so illiterate you CANT make the distinction between your argument and the source you use to prove your point. 

Sad a grown man doesn’t know the difference between can’t and won’t. 

 

No,  it's not.  Its skill.  Not every pass has to come out like a rocket. Like dropping it over the shoulder of a receiver that is covered. You know, like the throws Cousins won't and can't make. 

 

 

Nice try though 

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3 hours ago, nottingham14 said:

Also another education in distinction.....

Cousins, nor Gruden named any specific routes he wouldn’t throw, as you assert. What Gruden is clearly identifying to anyone with any sense, is Cousins will only throw routes where guys are open and not take risks. I never saw him say Cousins won’t throw a Go Route because he CANT. Or that he CANT throw a 15 yard out. He said he can’t scheme so every pass he throws is to a wide open WR.

When you say routes you are talking specific routes by name, curl, go, slant and so on. When he says routes he’s meaning in general all the routes in a game, some are open and some are not, so Cousins won’t throw to guys not open, being risk averse.

It's the NFL. Receivers are rarely open. 

 

I guess that's why Cousins only threw 10 passes in week 1 :roll:

 

 

F'n R-words fans,  I tell ya.  :lol:

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3 hours ago, nottingham14 said:

Foles arm strength:

"If we were to take a step back, and suss out a more general takeaway from Nick Foles’ success under Chip Kelly and now again under Doug Pederson, it would be this: he can quickly make your defenders wrong. Arm strength and ball velocity are not strengths of Foles’, but processing speed and pre-snap recognition are.”

https://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2019/1/3/18165047/nick-foles-philadelphia-eagles-doug-pederson-chip-kelly

 

https://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2012/12/18/3778840/raanan-review-nick-foles-arm-strength

 

 

Yeah... The discussion at the time was about their perceived skill set coming out of college. Not cherry picked article from the last few years. 

 

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8 hours ago, nottingham14 said:

Foles arm strength:

"If we were to take a step back, and suss out a more general takeaway from Nick Foles’ success under Chip Kelly and now again under Doug Pederson, it would be this: he can quickly make your defenders wrong. Arm strength and ball velocity are not strengths of Foles’, but processing speed and pre-snap recognition are.”

https://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2019/1/3/18165047/nick-foles-philadelphia-eagles-doug-pederson-chip-kelly

 

https://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2012/12/18/3778840/raanan-review-nick-foles-arm-strength

 

 

https://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2012nfoles.php

 

 

 

Strengths:

  • Powerful arm
  • Quick release
  • Big pocket presence
  • Gritty; fighter
  • Excellent height
  • Good bulk to take hits
  • Durable
  • Improved accuracy
  • Displays gunslinger mentality
  • Experienced 3-year starter

 

The "Foles has a weak arm" things is a myth and always has been. He was known to have a pretty strong arm coming out of college and has shown that in the pros. One or two people in the media said it and morons like you grabbed it and just ran with it. Again, have you watched any actual games in the past decade or do you just read articles and stats?

 

 

Also none of this has anything to do with Cousins. Neither does Howies drafting or if Mills is any good. 

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9 hours ago, nottingham14 said:

Oh damn!!! He made a bad throw?!!!! Into double coverage?!!!!! Well there it is!!!! He’s trash! No other QB has ever done that!!!! 

He has made a bunch of them. Always at the worst time. The only thing that has saved him from making more of them is his propensity to fumble the game away, which saves him from making more bad throws. 

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Do people still really buy this idea that Coupons is a good QB? Despite all the evidence that shows he doesn't win games against teams with a winning record?

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11 hours ago, paco said:

No,  it's not.  Its skill.  Not every pass has to come out like a rocket. Like dropping it over the shoulder of a receiver that is covered. You know, like the throws Cousins won't and can't make. 

 

 

Nice try though 

You are talking out of both sides of your mouth. The Foles arm strength argument stemmed from the Cousins argument. So to say you don’t mean arm strength is a complete lie. 

 

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6 hours ago, boogyman said:

He has made a bunch of them. Always at the worst time. The only thing that has saved him from making more of them is his propensity to fumble the game away, which saves him from making more bad throws. 

EVERY QUARTERBACK HAS BAD PLAYS AND THROWS. Given a long enough timeline everyone has down games and periods. But overall the guy has put up stats comparable to Brees, which is not anything to laugh at. 

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5 hours ago, UK_EaglesFan89 said:

Do people still really buy this idea that Coupons is a good QB? Despite all the evidence that shows he doesn't win games against teams with a winning record?

Manning at his worst, which was AWFUL, won a SB. Sometimes winning is more than just the QB. If Cousins continues that trend in MINN I could see the point. But in WASH he was on a terrible team. Y’all act like WASH wasn’t trash before and after Cousins. Their FO, starting with Snyder, has always been trash. 

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8 minutes ago, nottingham14 said:

Manning at his worst, which was AWFUL, won a SB. Sometimes winning is more than just the QB. If Cousins continues that trend in MINN I could see the point. But in WASH he was on a terrible team. Y’all act like WASH wasn’t trash before and after Cousins. Their FO, starting with Snyder, has always been trash. 

Washington weren't trash when he was there actually. 

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1 hour ago, nottingham14 said:

You are talking out of both sides of your mouth. The Foles arm strength argument stemmed from the Cousins argument. So to say you don’t mean arm strength is a complete lie. 

 

Quite the opposite.  I've been very steady with the points Ive made and provided back up to those points. 

 

You however have tried, repeatedly, to claim things that wernt said and now are saying "you are talking out of both sides of your mouth".  Like arm strength.  And you are the one that brought up Foles, not me.  :wacko: 

 

 

R-words fans :roll: 

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Lets recap, since apparently you are projecting when calling people illiterate

 

On 3/15/2018 at 6:25 PM, paco said:

And even with Desean and Garcon to throw to he still couldnt get double digit wins.  Hell, he didn't beat a team with a winning record the year they went 9-7 and "won" the division.

 

Hes average.  He knows he's average.  He even told Gruden there are routes he won't throw because he's likely to get picked off (that's why his INT rate dropped dramatically)

 

On 3/15/2018 at 6:37 PM, nottingham14 said:

So his INT rate dropped because he wont throw certain routes? :roll: 

You crack me up. You act like he has the arm strength of a 5 year old. Like I said before, he had the same arm strength as many guys who have succeeded. He is at very least a poor man's Drew Brees. Which makes him well worth the money he is paid, considering how good Brees is. Now he is going to a dome, where half his games will be played without wind conditions. That is exactly what Brees did, like I pointed out earlier. He will also play in a dome in DET too. That's 9 guaranteed dome games a season. 

Diggs and Thelien are looking like stellar WRs. I think Diggs is a real star if given the chance, but AT is also pretty talented and out shined Diggs last season. That's a good group to have, with Cook in the backfield who can catch too, if healthy. The team he chose shows how smart the guy is TBH. Of the teams out there after him, he chose the best possible spot for him. 

 

On 3/15/2018 at 6:42 PM, nottingham14 said:

BTW you know who also was said to have a weak arm coming out of college? Nick Foles did too. But did it stop him from leading the NFL in completions over 40 yards in one season? NO! Did his weak arm stop him from dropping a dime to Alshon in the SB? NO! 

Quit listening to the ESPN Stephen A Smith rhetoric and pay attention. Yeah, its nice to have a guy who can throw a laser to any guy on the field from anywhere. But does it do Stafford any good? What about Cutler? Id take Cousins over both of them all day, every day. 

 

 

So the points are the same as they always were back in March of 2018:

1) He's very average

2) He can't make all the throws  (Actual interview with coach and player provided)

 

Points added with your further rants that you now try to deflect from

1) Nick Foles coming out of college had arm strength as one of his top assets.  (Scouting reports provided as back up)

 

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16 hours ago, nottingham14 said:

If you are saying CANT MAKE THROWS, that’s arm strength.

Not necessarily, it could also be accuracy or decisionmaking. Jamarcus Russell had an astoundingly strong arm, but he was also stupid and sucked at placing the ball.

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You're also comparing Cousin's stats now to Brees' stats 13 years ago, as if the league rules haven't been changed to make throwing for 4,000 yards and 30 TDs at a 70% completion rate much easier than it ever has been.

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46 minutes ago, EaglesRocker97 said:

Not necessarily, it could also be accuracy or decisionmaking. Jamarcus Russell had an astoundingly strong arm, but he was also stupid and sucked at placing the ball.

and touch.

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