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[News] Early Thinking On Some Roster Battles To Watch

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1 hour ago, mjkline1958 said:

If we go into FA and the draft w/ Howie again ( wrongly ) thinking he's a great talent evaluator, this is one fan who will again go back to being a casual observer. Watching what's been going on - or not going on - with the team, I've been fearful of this for a while, esp w/ our needs at WR and the secondary where Howie seems weakest.

  The Eagles have drafted eight wide receivers since 2010, the year after they took Jeremy Maclin. Who has the best career numbers of those eight? Jordan Matthews, of course. Next on the list is Nelson Agholor, who has had his moments but has put up some of the worst numbers in NFL history by a first-round wide receiver. Riley Cooper had a decent year in 2013, but that’s about it. Josh Huff was a disaster as a third-round pick, Mack Hollins has done nothing to warrant being a fourth-round pick and JJ Arcega-Whiteside can’t even get on the field. It’s not just Howie Roseman. Agholor was a Chip Kelly pick and Huff was probably more of a Kelly pick, although Roseman was still the GM. The bottom line is none of them are elite. For the record, Cooper was drafted before Antonio Brown, Huff before John Brown and Agholor before Stefon Diggs. It’s too early to fairly compare JJAW with D.K. Metcalf, Terry McLaurin or Diontae Johnson, but the early returns aren’t encouraging. [BLG Note: Allow me to add that Riley Cooper is the only wide receiver drafted in the Howie Roseman era to receive a contract extension with the Eagles

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Look at some of the outside receivers the Eagles have brought in. Last year, they added Kamar Aiken, Bryce Treggs, Mike Wallace, Markus Wheaton. They signed guys like Braxton Miller, Reggie Davis and Dorren Miller to the practice squad. This past summer, it was guys like Marken Michel, Charles Johnson, Johnny Holton, Devon Ross and Marcus Green. Greg Ward has been around for a few years but can’t get on the field. Now, some of these guys were just training camp legs, but none of them are even in the league at this point. You want your developmental guys to develop, and theirs aren’t. 

The Eagles didn’t make a move at the trade deadline, yet six days later Doug Pederson stood there at a press conference and talked about how important it was for the Eagles to add a receiver. It’s hard to imagine guys like Robby Anderson of the Jets, A.J. Green of the Bengals or DeVante Parker of the Dolphins couldn’t be had. The 49ers and Patriots are the NFL’s two best teams right now, and they went out and got receivers. The 49ers traded 2nd- and 3rd-round picks to the Broncos for Emmanuel Sanders and a 5. The Patriots got Mohamed Sanu from the Falcons for a 2nd-round pick. It’s a lot to give up, but the Eagles have plenty of picks, and even Roseman would have to admit the Eagles have a better chance of landing a productive receiver in a trade than through the draft.

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The Eagles’ wide receivers coach is Carson Walch. He’s their fifth wide receivers coach in five years following Bob Bicknell in 2015, Greg Lewis in 2016, Mike Groh in 2017 and Gunter Brewer in 2018. When multiple players regress at the same time — and you can say that about Jeffery, Agholor and Hollins — and young players don’t progress the way they should, like JJAW, the first person you look at is the position coach. The lack of continuity at the position isn’t ideal, and so far the results under Walch are dreadful.

When last year ended, Matthews and Golden Tate were both on the roster. In fact, they were the only wide receivers to catch postseason TD passes last year — Tate the 4th-down game-winner in Chicago and Matthews a 37-yarder against the Saints. The Eagles elected to let both of them go, presumably to help them with the compensatory pick formula. Tate is averaging 64 yards per game for the Giants, and Matthews is now back after spending the offseason and bits of this year with the 49ers. If the Eagles like Matthews enough to keep bringing him back, why not just keep him in the first place? Sometimes it seems like Roseman’s decision making is geared too heavily to maximizing the team’s compensatory pick stash instead of simply putting the best 53-man roster on the field

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You certainly don't HAVE to cheer for Andy Reid to win a Super Bowl in Kansas City. ... Andy is our ex-girlfriend, and I'd like to see him find "the one” out in Kansas City, ... He was not a good talent evaluator while with the Eagles and that is showing now as KC shines cause he is not in charge. Andy Reid makes it clear that John Dorsey was the man who made the picks through five draft cycles. His footprints are all over the team... He's an awesome talent evaluator and guy. Dorsey was fired in 2017 about a month after the draft due to his communication skills and not his talent evaluation however the Chiefs didn't skip a beat due to an ex Eagles talent scout  who took his place and you may have heard of him. His name is Brett Veach and he has been an up and comer in talent evaluation for a while now. This guy worked for the Eagles from 2004 to 2009 until he got his promotion to scout in 2010. He worked for two years in that capacity and then went to work for the Chiefs. These are the guys that the Eagles can't afford to let go. A good talent evaluator is worth his weight in gold. These are some of the reasons why the Eagles have problems in the draft. Not only can't they judge good draft talent but they can't judge good talent evaluators either. 

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3 hours ago, mjkline1958 said:

If we go into FA and the draft w/ Howie again ( wrongly ) thinking he's a great talent evaluator, this is one fan who will again go back to being a casual observer. Watching what's been going on - or not going on - with the team, I've been fearful of this for a while, esp w/ our needs at WR and the secondary where Howie seems weakest.

IDK injuries at WR and what we did with the PS players(whomever drafted them) was pretty impressive(Ward not Jjaw-he was disappointing).So draft picks and FA's that can't play due to lack of a med staff and related injuries aren't really Howie's issues in my view.Jjaw was ranked fairly high(but so was MS2),so are we ruining the WR's we draft?? Maybe that explains the release? I would like to see some staff that can develop these players.We do a fantastic job with TE's.Maybe one of those staff need to go on the WR staff.Maybe that whole department is being wasted and better used on the WR aspect,then replace the TE staff

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MaAIgBaS_x96.jpg
 
#Eagles GM Howie Roseman is growing an executive tree: Last spring, it was Joe Douglas going to the #Jets to be their GM, now it’s Andrew Berry going to the #Browns
 
NFL_Clubs_2019_2020_Emojis_ClevelandBrow

. Berry had his hand in everything in Philly, expanding on the work he did in his first stop in Cleveland.

 

Think this at least shows that Howie is definitely trying to bring in respected guys in the league to help and work with him. And these guys are doing enough to get promoted to GMs themselves. 

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2 hours ago, 1wrangler said:

Look at some of the outside receivers the Eagles have brought in. Last year, they added Kamar Aiken, Bryce Treggs, Mike Wallace, Markus Wheaton. They signed guys like Braxton Miller, Reggie Davis and Dorren Miller to the practice squad. This past summer, it was guys like Marken Michel, Charles Johnson, Johnny Holton, Devon Ross and Marcus Green. Greg Ward has been around for a few years but can’t get on the field. Now, some of these guys were just training camp legs, but none of them are even in the league at this point. You want your developmental guys to develop, and theirs aren’t. 

The Eagles didn’t make a move at the trade deadline, yet six days later Doug Pederson stood there at a press conference and talked about how important it was for the Eagles to add a receiver. It’s hard to imagine guys like Robby Anderson of the Jets, A.J. Green of the Bengals or DeVante Parker of the Dolphins couldn’t be had. The 49ers and Patriots are the NFL’s two best teams right now, and they went out and got receivers. The 49ers traded 2nd- and 3rd-round picks to the Broncos for Emmanuel Sanders and a 5. The Patriots got Mohamed Sanu from the Falcons for a 2nd-round pick. It’s a lot to give up, but the Eagles have plenty of picks, and even Roseman would have to admit the Eagles have a better chance of landing a productive receiver in a trade than through the draft.

I can agree with most of this,until the last sentence.First we need to define "productive" What is production,most yards? most TD's? If you look at the Eagles of late and we had ZERO WR's over 500 yards,no matter the TD rate,this is serious LACK of production.Your slot guy,like your TE's should be the guys with the lower yardage,but they are important for 3rd down conversions and RZ TD's.Your outside guys are the yard makers and field stretchers to get the running game going.I love speed guys like anyone and losing Djax hurt us badly.But the fact is,we had no speed guys in reserve.The draft is where you get these "other" guys,to learn,step up their game and eventually take that starting spot.But as this happens,you need to keep drafting those replacements. FA in our case and IN MY OPINION are due to "panic" that we can't do what I mentioned.if you can't bring guys along,you have no choice but to hit FA.I want that stopped.I want "the pipeline".We are doing that at RB and TE,so WHO is NOT doing their job and getting these young players in??? 

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4 minutes ago, BleedingGreen93 said:
 
 
 
MaAIgBaS_x96.jpg
 
#Eagles GM Howie Roseman is growing an executive tree: Last spring, it was Joe Douglas going to the #Jets to be their GM, now it’s Andrew Berry going to the #Browns
 
NFL_Clubs_2019_2020_Emojis_ClevelandBrow

. Berry had his hand in everything in Philly, expanding on the work he did in his first stop in Cleveland.

 

Think this at least shows that Howie is definitely trying to bring in respected guys in the league to help and work with him. And these guys are doing enough to get promoted to GMs themselves. 

Noone wants to coach here now.When we won the SB everyone wanted to.After last season and losing games we should have won,they are heading out to find teams on the upswing.it's sad to me we won a SB,now back to basically .500 .OK injuries kicked us this year,but still there were seemingly "easy" games we lost.Doesn't sit well with me.I saw for most of the year early,that is either the O OR D playing.Rarely was it both.near the end,we did better,but the lack of "fire" early really bothered me.And I DID state that early,that we can't win games playing 30 minutes

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2 hours ago, 1wrangler said:

The Eagles’ wide receivers coach is Carson Walch. He’s their fifth wide receivers coach in five years following Bob Bicknell in 2015, Greg Lewis in 2016, Mike Groh in 2017 and Gunter Brewer in 2018. When multiple players regress at the same time — and you can say that about Jeffery, Agholor and Hollins — and young players don’t progress the way they should, like JJAW, the first person you look at is the position coach. The lack of continuity at the position isn’t ideal, and so far the results under Walch are dreadful.

When last year ended, Matthews and Golden Tate were both on the roster. In fact, they were the only wide receivers to catch postseason TD passes last year — Tate the 4th-down game-winner in Chicago and Matthews a 37-yarder against the Saints. The Eagles elected to let both of them go, presumably to help them with the compensatory pick formula. Tate is averaging 64 yards per game for the Giants, and Matthews is now back after spending the offseason and bits of this year with the 49ers. If the Eagles like Matthews enough to keep bringing him back, why not just keep him in the first place? Sometimes it seems like Roseman’s decision making is geared too heavily to maximizing the team’s compensatory pick stash instead of simply putting the best 53-man roster on the field

RE:JMatt- remember ALL our WR's were basically in the mash unit.He was one of the few FA's available.it doesn't mean we liked him enough to contract him,it means we had no other choices. Someone asked me once "besides death and that,what is the WORST thing that can happen to you".I thought about this a long time.My answer was "when you run out of options,because when you run out of options,you no longer control your future". A year later,I ran across that person again and they said "best advice I ever got". And so,it should hold true here.bad decisions can be made and corrected,but the worst is when you are out of options and that's what I'm seeing

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OVERALL

Here is a look at, according to this reporter, What Roseman has done overall with the draft picks made with him holding the title of general manager.

2010: 4 hits, 9 misses…1 still with team, 2 starters produced

2011: 2 hits, 8 misses….1 still with team, 1 starter produced

2012: 7 hits, 2 misses….4 still with team, 3 starters produced

2013: 3 hits, 5 misses….2 still with team, 3 starters produced

2014: 3 hits, 4 misses….2 still with team, 1 starter produced

2016: 3 hits, 5 misses….7 still with team, 3 starters produced

Overall: 22 hits, 33 misses

Roseman struggled during his first four years as general manager, as only 10 of the 47 players picked from 2010 to 2014 are still with team. The poor drafting has prevented this team from building a core, and forcing them to go out and sign big names in free agency.

The first round has not been kind to Roseman, as he has as many misses (3) and hits in the first round, picks that are supposed to not only turn into starters, but Pro Bowl players for a team.

He has also struggled to find hidden gems late in the draft. Of the 38 late-round picks (fourth round and later) Roseman has made, he has really only found Kelce (sixth round) as a legitimate starter that has played at a high level for an extended period of time. General managers aren't expected to hit on a high percentage of late round picks, but good ones find gems late that turn into starters, and Roseman hasn't been able to do that.

Roseman also hasn't had much luck finding starting-caliber players in general in the draft, with a total of 13 players from the 55 picks made from 2010-2016 ended up starting at least three seasons for the Eagles. Of the 22 players projected to start next week against Washington, 10 were drafted by Roseman, and only five of those 10 have been starters for more than three seasons.

With the initial signs from the 2017 draft not very good, it is clear that one of the major downfalls of Roseman during his time with the Eagles has been his inability to find quality, long-term starters in the draft.

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6 minutes ago, GreenbleedinFL said:

Noone wants to coach here now.When we won the SB everyone wanted to.After last season and losing games we should have won,they are heading out to find teams on the upswing.it's sad to me we won a SB,now back to basically .500 .OK injuries kicked us this year,but still there were seemingly "easy" games we lost.Doesn't sit well with me.I saw for most of the year early,that is either the O OR D playing.Rarely was it both.near the end,we did better,but the lack of "fire" early really bothered me.And I DID state that early,that we can't win games playing 30 minutes

Everyone wanted to coach here after our SB???? We literally didn’t talk to anyone outside the organization for the OC just promoted Groh...Walch was some college guy that never coached nfl WRs before...Didn't seems to me they were lining up to take a job in Philly.

Reality is any up and coming OC likely doesn’t want to be in a place where they don’t get to call plays.

As for WR coach after 4 failed hires(Groh was a hit promotion was a fail) I’m perfectly fine taking that hire slow making sure you nail it.

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2 minutes ago, 1wrangler said:

OVERALL

Here is a look at, according to this reporter, What Roseman has done overall with the draft picks made with him holding the title of general manager.

2010: 4 hits, 9 misses…1 still with team, 2 starters produced

2011: 2 hits, 8 misses….1 still with team, 1 starter produced

2012: 7 hits, 2 misses….4 still with team, 3 starters produced

2013: 3 hits, 5 misses….2 still with team, 3 starters produced

2014: 3 hits, 4 misses….2 still with team, 1 starter produced

2016: 3 hits, 5 misses….7 still with team, 3 starters produced

Overall: 22 hits, 33 misses

Roseman struggled during his first four years as general manager, as only 10 of the 47 players picked from 2010 to 2014 are still with team. The poor drafting has prevented this team from building a core, and forcing them to go out and sign big names in free agency.

The first round has not been kind to Roseman, as he has as many misses (3) and hits in the first round, picks that are supposed to not only turn into starters, but Pro Bowl players for a team.

He has also struggled to find hidden gems late in the draft. Of the 38 late-round picks (fourth round and later) Roseman has made, he has really only found Kelce (sixth round) as a legitimate starter that has played at a high level for an extended period of time. General managers aren't expected to hit on a high percentage of late round picks, but good ones find gems late that turn into starters, and Roseman hasn't been able to do that.

Roseman also hasn't had much luck finding starting-caliber players in general in the draft, with a total of 13 players from the 55 picks made from 2010-2016 ended up starting at least three seasons for the Eagles. Of the 22 players projected to start next week against Washington, 10 were drafted by Roseman, and only five of those 10 have been starters for more than three seasons.

With the initial signs from the 2017 draft not very good, it is clear that one of the major downfalls of Roseman during his time with the Eagles has been his inability to find quality, long-term starters in the draft.

To be honest anything before 2016 to me doesn’t matter...2016 was the start of a new team believe Howie made drastic changes as well in his return. 2016-19 feel as though the drafts overall have been avg. with a mix of good and bad picks 

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2 minutes ago, 1wrangler said:

OVERALL

Here is a look at, according to this reporter, What Roseman has done overall with the draft picks made with him holding the title of general manager.

2010: 4 hits, 9 misses…1 still with team, 2 starters produced

2011: 2 hits, 8 misses….1 still with team, 1 starter produced

2012: 7 hits, 2 misses….4 still with team, 3 starters produced

2013: 3 hits, 5 misses….2 still with team, 3 starters produced

2014: 3 hits, 4 misses….2 still with team, 1 starter produced

2016: 3 hits, 5 misses….7 still with team, 3 starters produced

Overall: 22 hits, 33 misses

Roseman struggled during his first four years as general manager, as only 10 of the 47 players picked from 2010 to 2014 are still with team. The poor drafting has prevented this team from building a core, and forcing them to go out and sign big names in free agency.

The first round has not been kind to Roseman, as he has as many misses (3) and hits in the first round, picks that are supposed to not only turn into starters, but Pro Bowl players for a team.

He has also struggled to find hidden gems late in the draft. Of the 38 late-round picks (fourth round and later) Roseman has made, he has really only found Kelce (sixth round) as a legitimate starter that has played at a high level for an extended period of time. General managers aren't expected to hit on a high percentage of late round picks, but good ones find gems late that turn into starters, and Roseman hasn't been able to do that.

Roseman also hasn't had much luck finding starting-caliber players in general in the draft, with a total of 13 players from the 55 picks made from 2010-2016 ended up starting at least three seasons for the Eagles. Of the 22 players projected to start next week against Washington, 10 were drafted by Roseman, and only five of those 10 have been starters for more than three seasons.

With the initial signs from the 2017 draft not very good, it is clear that one of the major downfalls of Roseman during his time with the Eagles has been his inability to find quality, long-term starters in the draft.

Not all true.I think we are very good at UDFA pick ups. Saying Kelce was the only one I can't buy.Clement comes to mind.Adams played ok for a UDFA.Seriously the FO needs to track this board.We find the players,but big IF is,can we develop them?

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3 minutes ago, BleedingGreen93 said:

Everyone wanted to coach here after our SB???? We literally didn’t talk to anyone outside the organization for the OC just promoted Groh...Walch was some college guy that never coached nfl WRs before...Didn't seems to me they were lining up to take a job in Philly.

Reality is any up and coming OC likely doesn’t want to be in a place where they don’t get to call plays.

As for WR coach after 4 failed hires(Groh was a hit promotion was a fail) I’m perfectly fine taking that hire slow making sure you nail it.

SOOOOO how come we haven't signed coaches here yet?Were they all banging on Howie to hire them???? Nope,we are out hunting THEM,not the other way around 

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Weighing teams the draft picks play a part as well....having 4 top 50 picks is way more valuable and likely to produce better players then 4 6 & 7 round picks 

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5 minutes ago, BleedingGreen93 said:

Everyone wanted to coach here after our SB???? We literally didn’t talk to anyone outside the organization for the OC just promoted Groh...Walch was some college guy that never coached nfl WRs before...Didn't seems to me they were lining up to take a job in Philly.

Reality is any up and coming OC likely doesn’t want to be in a place where they don’t get to call plays.

As for WR coach after 4 failed hires(Groh was a hit promotion was a fail) I’m perfectly fine taking that hire slow making sure you nail it.

And those 2 are gone now lol 

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Just now, GreenbleedinFL said:

SOOOOO how come we haven't signed coaches here yet?Were they all banging on Howie to hire them???? Nope,we are out hunting THEM,not the other way around 

Or we just taking our time not rushing a hire...I don’t have an answer for this but just because we didn’t quickly hire someone doesn’t mean it is a bad thing.

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4 minutes ago, BleedingGreen93 said:

To be honest anything before 2016 to me doesn’t matter...2016 was the start of a new team believe Howie made drastic changes as well in his return. 2016-19 feel as though the drafts overall have been avg. with a mix of good and bad picks 

It should,we could have had the pipeline started in 2016. "drastic changes".How did that work out? We are back to square 1 with all the firing and loses 

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4 minutes ago, BleedingGreen93 said:

Or we just taking our time not rushing a hire...I don’t have an answer for this but just because we didn’t quickly hire someone doesn’t mean it is a bad thing.

LMAO,welp,we're taking our time to the point there is noone left to pick.WE said "Gruden".Nope,WE pointed out others.NOPE.it's disgusting when you have no plan before you start firing people and just blindly lose everyone.Howie needs to know who these possible guys are BEFORE making these moves.That is his job.Do your job

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Just now, GreenbleedinFL said:

LMAO,welp,we're taking our time to the point there is noone left to pick.WE said "Gruden".Nope,WE pointed out others.NOPE.it's disgusting when you have no plan before you start firing people and just blindly lose everyone.Howie needs to know who these possible guy are BEFORE making these moves.That is his job.Do your job

Lmao who says they don’t have a plan???? Just because you don’t know it and the news isn’t flooding in...Again if whoever we hire comes in and our O is doing great....You still going to be complaining oh well it took us X number of days to hire this guy lol....

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4 minutes ago, GreenbleedinFL said:

It should,we could have had the pipeline started in 2016. "drastic changes".How did that work out? We are back to square 1 with all the firing and loses 

This team was blown up twice once in 15 with Chipper in control then Again in 16 when Howie took back control...So yea anything before 2016 doesn’t concern me much...

Looking at the drafts from 2016-2019 how we faired been mixed bag of good and bad don’t view us as terrible or great in the middle to be honest 

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2 minutes ago, BleedingGreen93 said:

Lmao who says they don’t have a plan???? Just because you don’t know it and the news isn’t flooding in...Again if whoever we hire comes in and our O is doing great....You still going to be complaining oh well it took us X number of days to hire this guy lol....

WHO is left? I'll wait

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2 minutes ago, BleedingGreen93 said:

This team was blown up twice once in 15 with Chipper in control then Again in 16 when Howie took back control...So yea anything before 2016 doesn’t concern me much...

Looking at the drafts from 2016-2019 how we faired been mixed bag of good and bad don’t view us as terrible or great in the middle to be honest 

And we won the SB in 2017? You think that happened in a 1 year span? Highly doubtful.Either that or it was a total mircale

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