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2 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

I said multiple times it was underthrown by Foles. Take the wax out of your keyboard ears. I said the main mistake is he should have got the ball out earlier on the throw. Go back and count the posts I said these things. It’s been several.

IDK Ham.... was a lot of excuses there for that one play ... then saying he was hot ... when the second half was 6 for 12 for 44 yards...   My original point, which is the right one.  Foles had a bad game, no excuse for that.   It can be left there without the excuses.   

But its a good sign for us.   All that other stuff, plus the bad game from the BACKUP QB, still came with a chance to win prior to the last INT.   We get the better QB his full offseason and get the team rolling from the start ... not 6 for 12 for 44 yards rolling, I mean legit rolling lke 2017 after the full offseason.   I like our chances.  At some point, the inury bug can't be this bad, it has to even out.  

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4 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

IDK Ham.... was a lot of excuses there for that one play ... then saying he was hot ... when the second half was 6 for 12 for 44 yards...   My original point, which is the right one.  Foles had a bad game, no excuse for that.   It can be left there without the excuses.   

But its a good sign for us.   All that other stuff, plus the bad game from the BACKUP QB, still came with a chance to win prior to the last INT.   We get the better QB his full offseason and get the team rolling from the start ... not 6 for 12 for 44 yards rolling, I mean legit rolling lke 2017 after the full offseason.   I like our chances.  At some point, the inury bug can't be this bad, it has to even out.  

Plenty of excuses for Foles not having a better game. Like I said 1)the Saints being much more rested and we wore down.2)the defense just couldn’t get off the field.3)no running game4)WR play(the Saints starting covering Ertz with CB coverage. That effected us big time. Every WR had a drop also.) 5) I agree with injuries

 this was about much more than putting the blame on Foles

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6 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

You said Foles sucked. I just don’t agree with that. He was up and down. And that’s how I’d describe the whole team(except the RBs that could do nothing). Could have been better. Was much better than Wentz was versus the Saints. And I absolutely believe as far as Foles play goes...he was going down to win it at the end.

Yeah... his play was up until that awful throw... then it was down the rest of the game.  The majority of the game.   IMO he sucked... your opinion he wasn't great,  I'm ok disagreeing on this.  Foles is irrelevant now.  Until the if and when he decides to come back as the backup here, the mist should be over.    Overall though... with all the things that were aganst us, and with IMO sucky QB play, we still had a chance to win at the end.   That's a good sign.  Foles to Matthews... that's what we had to use, I expect better once we get the better players in there.  

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Alright so we’ve gone this far into it all. So let’s just legit break down the Saints game...offensively at least.

1st drive) 7 play 76 yard drive capped off with a 37 yard TD pass

 great drive by Foles

2nd drive) 10 play 75 yard drive big play on 3rd and 7 pass the Jeffrey. Capped off by a Foles running it in.

great drive by Foles

3rd drive)2 yard run, 14 yard pass, 2 yard run and then Lattimore interception

end of first quarter

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Second quarter

4th drive)14 yard pass, 1 yard run, 4 yard pass. That setup 3rd and 5. Then Peters False Start. 3rd and 10 incomplete.

failed running game and bad penalty killed the drive

5th drive) 11 yard pass, incomplete pass, 1 yard run setting up 3rd and 9. Incomplete pass

running game still failing to help anything but put us in the hole and Foles failed to convert long third down

 That’s the first half of the game

 

 

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So far, nothing disputing great start to game then not much else.   Go ahead.    Franchise QBs expected to overcome things though.   I think he sucked, will be hard to change my opinion based on anything else, I thought he sucked while watching... like a switch after the Ertz mistake that could have really put the game out of reach.  

Also... RPO quick passes type plays as the main thing... this is what happens if the D covers it, the QB stands there in a bad spot without much choice.   Foles has limitations when the defense plays well or guesses plays.  

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I don’t see QB play to blame here. It looks to me like he’s having a good game. Two huge TD scoring drives. We’ve debated the interception exhaustingly but I’ll just call that his mistake. Then he completes two passes, a failed run and a bad penalty setting up a long third down. Then the last drive of the half he completes a pass and misses a pass. Go to the run that once again is abysmal. Sets up a long third down.

 To me it seems like Foles is looking pretty darn good. Not great on completing long third downs. So he isn’t Tom Brady or Drew Brees. But made some big plays.

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2 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

don’t see QB play to blame here. It looks to me like he’s having a good game. Two huge TD scoring drives. We’ve debated the interception exhaustingly but I’ll just call that his mistake

Yep... kindda hard not to there.. eitehr bad throw or bad decision?   I'll go with bad throw... regardless of the great sneaky QB play there... it was well underthrown, I'd like to see him make the decision over again every time, just make the throw.   From that point on he led the team to zero points.   He needs to take some responsibility there, can't always be an excuse, that won't fly in his next job.   

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1 minute ago, joemas6 said:

Yep... kindda hard not to there.. eitehr bad throw or bad decision?   I'll go with bad throw... regardless of the great sneaky QB play there... it was well underthrown, I'd like to see him make the decision over again every time, just make the throw.   From that point on he led the team to zero points.   He needs to take some responsibility there, can't always be an excuse, that won't fly in his next job.   

I don’t care about his next job. We’ve debated the interception. I’m just talking about did he suck against the Saints. Fourth drive(after... like you said) he completed a pass for a first down. Then they tried to run....gong...failed. Then he completes a short pass. 3rd and 5. Then false start penalty. 3rd and 10. Two completed passes, a failed run and then a penalty. That isn’t on Foles at all. Everybody but Foles in fact.

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3 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

Alright so you state great start of the game from the QB

Always been my narrative.... plus first quarter, minus for the next 3.   That's a total bad grade for me.   3/4 of the game was pretty bad.  I mean,  SB MVP, step it up and complete 2 passes in a row.   I really think the brutal key mistake of the first INT might have gotten to him, right after that the fake punt really pushed momentum to NO.  None of that happens without the mistake.   

If he is my franchise QB, ... he has one good quarter, then makes a big mistake that changes momentum, and doesn't produce a point after that.   He sucks.  If its my backup, then I look for excuses.   Wentz sucked vs The Saints, and Seattle and KC last year.   i'm not going to point out a few outstanding plays... IMO the total performance, if you want to be a franchise QB was a bad one.   Is it the sole reason for losing the game, doesn't have to be, still doesn't make me change my opinion if a player sucks in a particular game.  

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Just now, cunninghamtheman said:

I don’t care about his next job. We’ve debated the interception

Whats the debate on the INT ... its his fault.  However you want to spin it. Ball was 10 yards underthrown.  Or bad decision if you want to debate that... he had a B+ first half , thats great... its your opinion.   The key mistake can erase a lot don't you think.   It was a key mistake.  That's life.  

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1 minute ago, joemas6 said:

Always been my narrative.... plus first quarter, minus for the next 3.   That's a total bad grade for me.   3/4 of the game was pretty bad.  I mean,  SB MVP, step it up and complete 2 passes in a row. 

 

Alright you’re just flat out wrong here. He did exactly that. Completed two straight passes. You blame him for the one yard run and the false start penalty clearly. Or expect him to be Superman and convert 3rd and longs all day.

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1 minute ago, cunninghamtheman said:

 Or expect him to be Superman and convert 3rd and longs all day.

How many third and longs did Brady complete vs KC?   How many did Brees convert vs our D that day?    

Personally... no I don't expect it from Foles... because I don't think Foles is on that level.   But he could convert one or two of them though, he is normally better than his play this particular game.  I think he is great when things go his way.   I do however, expect him to complete that key pass to Ertz.   He is good enough for that.  I think that got in his head for sure after that.   The next time he came on the field 14-7, with momentum shifted, it was all dowhill from there.     

Maybe he should have debated with Groh a little to change some plays... IDK, I can't let him off the hook though.    Still waiting on 2nd half analysis.   Anything better than a gift C- from you and we can switch conversation to Flyers trade deadline talk.   

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Alright so we put the blame on Foles for the interception. What’s your grade for his first half performance? 2 long TD drives and an interception. First down passes followed up by failed third and long conversions on the next two drives. No run game after the Agholor Sweep.

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2 minutes ago, joemas6 said:

How many third and longs did Brady complete vs KC?   How many did Brees convert vs our D that day?    

 

If the bar to not suck means comparing favorably to Brees and Brady then...I don’t even really need to finish that thought do I?

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2 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

Alright so we put the blame on Foles for the interception. What’s your grade for his first half performance? 2 long TD drives and an interception. First down passes followed up by failed third and long conversions on the next two drives. No run game after the Agholor Sweep.

A first quarter.... C 2nd quarter at best.    Gotta convert one 3rd and long if you want to be a franchise QB.   The fact of how important the INT was, has to be accounted for, it's more than if it was not a crucial play.    I would say C or C minus depending how much you weigh the importance of the INT.    To be honest though, I thought the play calling was great, I was more impressed with Doug in the 1st quarter, but can't give less than an A for 2 drives, 2 TDs.    I'm good with B or B minus first half.   We can go with B for arguments sake.  moving on to 2nd half.  

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4 minutes ago, cunninghamtheman said:

If the bar to not suck means comparing favorably to Brees and Brady then...I don’t even really need to finish that thought do I?

Go ahead.... 2nd half ... 6 for 12 ... 44 yards.   Prior to Alshon INT... so that's nothing from me on Foles.   He did his normal throw a 2 yard pass.. the safe play where you can't really blame him.  The McNabb decision to dump down... the one we kill Bradford for... but that's fine.   The drives before there, we can go right to there.  

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Alright second half:

 first play run for a whole 2 yards. Then we miss Brooks in the hostile environment. Called timeout because Kelce won’t shotgun snap in time. Completed pass to Jeffrey. 3rd and 4. Foles hit as he throws but delivers a nice high ball to Jeffrey. Alshon didn’t create separation though and can’t haul in the contested catch(coverage by Bell far from Pro Bowl corner). Punt

run game continues to fail. Oline fails on snap and third down protection. Foles put the ball where he needed to under pressure(can’t seem to blame him at all on this drive)

[Saints go on a quarter long drive overcoming a bunch of penalties to score]

2nd drive) Smallwood run for 2.5 yards. Then false start penalty. But Foles overcomes getting hit on both sides by pass rush and converts the pass for a first down.

End of 3rd quarter. Good quarter by Foles. Didn’t get much of an opportunity.

2nd drive continued) Foles hit as he throws and Alshon pulled down/fell down...incomplete. Short pass to Sproles. 3rd down— nobody gets open. Foles slides and throws it up for Tate. Saint defender never turns around but blocks pass. Possible face guard penalty. But Tate wasn’t open/pass wasn’t going anywhere good anyway. 

Big pass by Foles is wasted on the next set of downs. They tackled Sproles well on his play. WR fault on the two other pass plays. Jeffrey fell when thrown to under pressure. I can’t blame Foles there. Then on third down coverage was like glue. Nobody got open.

 

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Guys let it go Foles and the run game both did nothing in the 2nd half so they both sucked our D was great we just needed more offense and nobody did squat put the blame anywhere you want it's a team game. In the playoffs if you don't play 60 minutes of football you lose. We didn't do that as a team. 

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DWD I think I just clearly established that Foles wasn’t to blame in the third quarter. The Saints had  the ball the whole time. They kept committing penalties and our D kept letting them off the hook. It was an 11:28 drive

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